The thing I always wondered about is where did the Aston Martin come from at the beginning of QOS? At the end of CR, we see Mr. White come through a very large gate (presumably he closed the gate behind him), drive down a very long drive, and in a long shot we see him pull up in front of his house.
No Aston Martin in sight!
Immediately prior to the beginning of QOS, the injured Mr. White must have been bundled into the trunk of the Aston Martin (Jesper Christensen doesn't seem like a very big guy but I'm surprised he can be fit into the trunk of a DBS).
Where did it come from? (and, no, TP they didn't borrow the invisibilty technology from DAD, this is the reboot!).
And where did all those Alfa Romeos full of bad guys come from?
Where was Bond when he shot Mr. White? Out of sight, and so was the Aston Martin. He had to get to Mr. White's villa somehow, and I doubt he took the bus. He probably just parked the car off the road down from Mr. White's villa. Is that so unlikely? Roger Moore parked his Aston Martin DBS in the woods in The Persuaders when he wanted to sneak up on a house, so Bond likely did the same with his Aston Martin DBS.
The Alfa Romeos are a bit more difficult to reason. My explanation is that Mr. White had a security system and men were stationed nearby if the security system/monitors detected anything.
Bond enjoyed himself. Poured himself a bottle of the very best vintage claret from the wine cellar, and set about methodically torturing Mr White over a two-month period. Skimped on the gym and the food a bit, so lost a bit of weight and muscle tone. Sent out for a change of clothes and a new car, texted HQ to make out he was on leave. Only then did he make a move, and that's when the enemy's fleet showed up...
The thing I always wondered about is where did the Aston Martin come from at the beginning of QOS? At the end of CR, we see Mr. White come through a very large gate (presumably he closed the gate behind him), drive down a very long drive, and in a long shot we see him pull up in front of his house.
No Aston Martin in sight!
Immediately prior to the beginning of QOS, the injured Mr. White must have been bundled into the trunk of the Aston Martin (Jesper Christensen doesn't seem like a very big guy but I'm surprised he can be fit into the trunk of a DBS).
Where did it come from? (and, no, TP they didn't borrow the invisibilty technology from DAD, this is the reboot!).
And where did all those Alfa Romeos full of bad guys come from?
Where was Bond when he shot Mr. White? Out of sight, and so was the Aston Martin. He had to get to Mr. White's villa somehow, and I doubt he took the bus. He probably just parked the car off the road down from Mr. White's villa. Is that so unlikely? Roger Moore parked his Aston Martin DBS in the woods in The Persuaders when he wanted to sneak up on a house, so Bond likely did the same with his Aston Martin DBS.
The Alfa Romeos are a bit more difficult to reason. My explanation is that Mr. White had a security system and men were stationed nearby if the security system/monitors detected anything.
When I saw CR, I thought he came in by boat. There's a sailboat moored about 150 feet out. Bond could've taken a dinghy in with another person, gotten out, and then the dinghy returned.
The area around Mr. White's house is thickly wooded and there are other houses close by, so everything is quite cramped and I think Mr. White would've noticed the luxury sports car parked in the woods as he came down his drive. And the Aston Martin DBS isn't exactly an off road vehicle, so I don't know where he could've hidden. Just because Sir Rog did something unrealistic 45 years ago doesn't make it sensible in this gritty, realistic age!
And where were all the Alfa Romeos? Were they in the woods as well?
Thunderbird 2East of Cardiff, Wales.Posts: 2,777MI6 Agent
edited September 2015
Ok.
Bonds new dinner suit. He's indignant. Nothing wrong with his existing one. Vesper is countering it was not classy enough, hence she got him a high quality tailored one. Bond notes this. Vesper counters he is too easy to measure up. - in every sense! I love that scene.
Bond lost the money, after Vesper stole it for Quantum. I believe we see the security case in the water, then subsiquently, after Vesper dies?) White pick it up and walk away. I would not be surprised if the funds transferred for the Bolivia project in QoS come from this funding. But that is wishful guesswork on my part.
Re White at the end of CR-06, although we know QoS is supposed to start immediately after the end of CR-06 we don't know how much time passes between Bond getting the message on Vespers phone while he is talking to M from the yacht in Venice and the subsiquent scene when Bond shoots and captures White overlooking Lake Como. Probably been a couple of days, but it could have been several months or even a year! (M's office does completely change, she replaces Villiers as her PA, Tanner joins the dept at some point, the Prime Minister retires in favour of his deputy*. and Bond has a new Aston!)
* Gordon Brown replacing Tony Blair in reality. Plus the recession hit in 2008 as well. Quantum?
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Bond most likely had the DBS parked down the Road somewhere. That's the most likely Explanation. And as Matt said, the Alfas were probably just part of Whites Security Team.
1.On Her Majesties Secret Service 2.The Living Daylights 3.license To Kill 4.The Spy Who Loved Me 5.Goldfinger
The thing I always wondered about is where did the Aston Martin come from at the beginning of QOS? At the end of CR, we see Mr. White come through a very large gate (presumably he closed the gate behind him), drive down a very long drive, and in a long shot we see him pull up in front of his house.
No Aston Martin in sight!
Immediately prior to the beginning of QOS, the injured Mr. White must have been bundled into the trunk of the Aston Martin (Jesper Christensen doesn't seem like a very big guy but I'm surprised he can be fit into the trunk of a DBS).
Where did it come from? (and, no, TP they didn't borrow the invisibilty technology from DAD, this is the reboot!).
And where did all those Alfa Romeos full of bad guys come from?
Where was Bond when he shot Mr. White? Out of sight, and so was the Aston Martin. He had to get to Mr. White's villa somehow, and I doubt he took the bus. He probably just parked the car off the road down from Mr. White's villa. Is that so unlikely? Roger Moore parked his Aston Martin DBS in the woods in The Persuaders when he wanted to sneak up on a house, so Bond likely did the same with his Aston Martin DBS.
The Alfa Romeos are a bit more difficult to reason. My explanation is that Mr. White had a security system and men were stationed nearby if the security system/monitors detected anything.
When I saw CR, I thought he came in by boat. There's a sailboat moored about 150 feet out. Bond could've taken a dinghy in with another person, gotten out, and then the dinghy returned.
The area around Mr. White's house is thickly wooded and there are other houses close by, so everything is quite cramped and I think Mr. White would've noticed the luxury sports car parked in the woods as he came down his drive. And the Aston Martin DBS isn't exactly an off road vehicle, so I don't know where he could've hidden. Just because Sir Rog did something unrealistic 45 years ago doesn't make it sensible in this gritty, realistic age!
And where were all the Alfa Romeos? Were they in the woods as well?
Okay, so if we go by the dinghy, then Mr. White went to the boat, and the boat took Bond to the Aston Martin. I still don't see why it would be so hard for Bond to park his car hidden nearby. A DBS could most certainly drive on grass. Or maybe he parked it in a neighbor's driveway. An Aston Martin would not be a remarkable site in such a rich area.
There's no way to rationalise the appearance of the Alfa Romeos if the sailboat is Bond's unless Mr. White has a tracking device like Bond's inside him.
Bond most likely had the DBS parked down the Road somewhere. That's the most likely Explanation. And as Matt said, the Alfas were probably just part of Whites Security Team.
If they were his "security team" they weren't very good as they let Bond shoot Mr. White and then they watched as Mr. White crawled across the drive and up the steps and Bond unhurriedly introduced himself and then presumably dragged Mr. White to wherever the Aston Martin is hidden (in the woods!), bundle him into the boot, and then drive off.
They must've been on a smoke break.
In their invisible Alfa Romeos.
I think the best explanantion is that the director wanted to have this really cool chase scene even if it broke continuity from the previous movie.
Bond most likely had the DBS parked down the Road somewhere. That's the most likely Explanation. And as Matt said, the Alfas were probably just part of Whites Security Team.
If they were his "security team" they weren't very good as they let Bond shoot Mr. White and then they watched as Mr. White crawled across the drive and up the steps and Bond unhurriedly introduced himself and then presumably dragged Mr. White to wherever the Aston Martin is hidden (in the woods!), bundle him into the boot, and then drive off.
They must've been on a smoke break.
In their invisible Alfa Romeos.
I think the best explanantion is that the director wanted to have this really cool chase scene even if it broke continuity from the previous movie.
He must have had a security team offsite and didn't want to be bothered by anyone at home. I'd guess M has the same thing and doesn't have a security team living with her.
Bond has the same Aston Martin in CR and QoS. It would appear he recovers it and has it repaired after the roll.
Fraid not. Same model, the V12 DBS, but different cars.
Different colour, different reg plate. CR-06 = TT 378 20. And QoS = 72 GH3LD
Apparently the second one was also in the games Bloodstone and Legends.
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Bond has the same Aston Martin in CR and QoS. It would appear he recovers it and has it repaired after the roll.
Fraid not. Same model, the V12 DBS, but different cars.
Different colour, different reg plate. CR-06 = TT 378 20. And QoS = 72 GH3LD
Apparently the second one was also in the games Bloodstone and Legends.
I actually didn't realise that the DBS was a different colour. It's so similar!
And the first one is actually "just" a tarted up DB9. Casino Royale is one colour (grey it is sometimes called) and quantum silver is the next.
He also changes suit though Matt, as you know (from your excellent blog), so perhaps some willing suspension of disbelief is required (as per usual).
Daniel Craig changed his suit, but James Bond did not. The similarities between the two outfits mean that QoS outfit is supposed to be the same as the CR outfit, it's just Louise Frogley had different opinions than Lindy Hemming on what Daniel Craig should wear in Italy. The waistcoat was very out-of-place at the end of CR and didn't make sense in the setting. He looks like he's dressed for London. The three-piece suit is supposed to suggest at the end of CR that Bond had matured into the classic Bond, but in QoS he still hadn't changed. The waistcoat was no relevant and the outfit was better without it. The change from Brioni to Tom Ford is less relevant because that's the real world, not Bond's world. Since we're supposed to believe the suits are the same, are we also supposed to believe the cars are too?
After watching the movie again I realized my earlier post was in error. Mendel has Bond transfer his winnings from the casino's account to the Montenegro account (in the same bank) Vesper and the Treasury had set up that held Bond's stake to get him into the game. I think we are led to believe that because she is with Bond from the time she learns the account's password is her name until the time they arrive in Venice she does not have the opportunity to get the funds to Mr. White.
What puzzles me is if the account is in Bond's name, how would she be able to withdraw the funds in person?
I could see how she might do it electronically and just have them transferred to White since she now had the password to the account and was responsible for setting it up to begin with, but just waltzing into the bank and withdrawing it? Would any bank, even in Venice, hand over that amount of money in cash without contacting Bond? Also, how much do they keep in their vault? Even in Venice that sounds like a large amount of notes to be kept in a local branch vault. I know a banker and he said that branches usually never keep more than five figures in their branches for insurance reasons.
Sir MilesThe Wrong Side Of The WardrobePosts: 26,561Chief of Staff
After watching the movie again I realized my earlier post was in error. Mendel has Bond transfer his winnings from the casino's account to the Montenegro account (in the same bank) Vesper and the Treasury had set up that held Bond's stake to get him into the game. I think we are led to believe that because she is with Bond from the time she learns the account's password is her name until the time they arrive in Venice she does not have the opportunity to get the funds to Mr. White.
What puzzles me is if the account is in Bond's name, how would she be able to withdraw the funds in person?
I could see how she might do it electronically and just have them transferred to White since she now had the password to the account and was responsible for setting it up to begin with, but just waltzing into the bank and withdrawing it? Would any bank, even in Venice, hand over that amount of money in cash without contacting Bond? Also, how much do they keep in their vault? Even in Venice that sounds like a large amount of notes to be kept in a local branch vault. I know a banker and he said that branches usually never keep more than five figures in their branches for insurance reasons.
Yes, I thought the money was transferred into the Treasury account - but it's in Vesper's name, not Bond's...I thought she would be the one to transfer the winnings directly to SIS.
She held onto the money to use it to exchange for Bond's life...
YNWA 97
Thunderbird 2East of Cardiff, Wales.Posts: 2,777MI6 Agent
The change from Brioni to Tom Ford is less relevant because that's the real world, not Bond's world. Since we're supposed to believe the suits are the same, are we also supposed to believe the cars are too?
Doubtful. I saw the wrecks of the two Astons side by side at Bond in Motion. The Casino Ice and Quantum Silver colours are distinctly different, as well as the aforementioned reg plates. Plus there is the other blatant differences such as M's office, Bond's build, how long it took to discover the faked corpse of Vesper's boyfriend, etc.
It would have been better if QoS had established that White had been in custody for a month or so, then have Mitchell break him out. His leg could have been treated, it could have established that Quantum does not tell all of its operatives everything (hence White genuinely could not prove any useful info to MI6) and the rest of the story could still continue in the same way. Only with White's escape providing the car chase in Siena, rather than his capture.
Re the Bank account, would it not have been prudent to have a joint account in both Bond and Vesper's names? If Bond was poisoned / ball smacked to death / shot, Vesper would need to have access to get the funds back to the Treasury anyway?
Twice in the film, we see Vesper is Mistress of Coin. - 1) Bond asks her for the other £5 million when he loses. She refuses. - Leiter bails Bond out. 2) In Venice after the bedroom roll-play, Vesper says "I'll get the money, you get the supplies." Implying either of them could access the funds?
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Sir MilesThe Wrong Side Of The WardrobePosts: 26,561Chief of Staff
I'm not sure a joint bank account would have worked, TB2...wouldn't Bond have been able to access the extra £5m by himself if it was ? Or are you saying both would need to be present to access the account ?
As for the - "I'll get the money, you get the supplies" - line...looks to me only Vesper could access the money - which is usual in men/women relationships )
This is where the script gets fuzzy for me. In real life when dealing with that sum of money and there are two names on such an account, one person can only do transactions on the account with the approval of the other. In that case, Vesper could not have withdrawn the money without proving to the bank she had Bond's authorization.
If the casino is transferring the winnings to Bond's account, they wouldn't do it if they only had his account number. His name would have to be on that account for verification. It's very strange as Vesper tells Bond on the train the Treasury has created the account for him with the stake money deposited in it. Since this operation was supposed to be secret, they could not officially open the account, so Vesper would have had to open it by telling the bank she was doing it as Bond's representative - in which case she would not have full authority over the funds without Bond's authorization.
I supposed when it comes to shadowy world of MI6 anything is possible...after all they issue him passports and ID for him with fake names and identities (and probably credit cards along with them). So creating an account in a foreign bank would not be a problem for them using Vesper as their agent.
The other interesting thing is the metal briefcase itself. Are we assuming Vesper is carrying $120 m in cash in it? Would that be possible considering how small the case is? Is it more likely that this is the same type of case Mendel was carrying - which actually contains a secure portable hack resistant computer that they give to their millionaire customers that is electronically tied directly to the bank's servers and can be used for no other purpose, so the customer can do transactions from it? I've never hear of a bank doing this, but if access to their high end accounts could only be done through these cases outside the bank itself it would make them much more secure. It would also be easier and safer than trying to tote around that much cash. Without the access code to the account it would be useless to anyone stealing it. Since Vesper presumably already gave Mr. White the code and he had the case afte the palazzo sinking, then he would have transferred the money to a QUANTUM account.
I'm not sure a joint bank account would have worked, TB2...wouldn't Bond have been able to access the extra £5m by himself if it was ? Or are you saying both would need to be present to access the account ?
As for the - "I'll get the money, you get the supplies" - line...looks to me only Vesper could access the money - which is usual in men/women relationships )
Damn you M, - you sank my Bankleship! Excellent points, and no I was not thinking dual account access.
This is Thunderbird 2, how can I be of assistance?
Sir MilesThe Wrong Side Of The WardrobePosts: 26,561Chief of Staff
I'm not sure a joint bank account would have worked, TB2...wouldn't Bond have been able to access the extra £5m by himself if it was ? Or are you saying both would need to be present to access the account ?
As for the - "I'll get the money, you get the supplies" - line...looks to me only Vesper could access the money - which is usual in men/women relationships )
Damn you M, - you sank my Bankleship! Excellent points, and no I was not thinking dual account access.
It's funny how a point I'd not given any thought to suddenly sparks this discussion )
Comments
Where was Bond when he shot Mr. White? Out of sight, and so was the Aston Martin. He had to get to Mr. White's villa somehow, and I doubt he took the bus. He probably just parked the car off the road down from Mr. White's villa. Is that so unlikely? Roger Moore parked his Aston Martin DBS in the woods in The Persuaders when he wanted to sneak up on a house, so Bond likely did the same with his Aston Martin DBS.
The Alfa Romeos are a bit more difficult to reason. My explanation is that Mr. White had a security system and men were stationed nearby if the security system/monitors detected anything.
Obvious really.
Roger Moore 1927-2017
When I saw CR, I thought he came in by boat. There's a sailboat moored about 150 feet out. Bond could've taken a dinghy in with another person, gotten out, and then the dinghy returned.
The area around Mr. White's house is thickly wooded and there are other houses close by, so everything is quite cramped and I think Mr. White would've noticed the luxury sports car parked in the woods as he came down his drive. And the Aston Martin DBS isn't exactly an off road vehicle, so I don't know where he could've hidden. Just because Sir Rog did something unrealistic 45 years ago doesn't make it sensible in this gritty, realistic age!
And where were all the Alfa Romeos? Were they in the woods as well?
Bonds new dinner suit. He's indignant. Nothing wrong with his existing one. Vesper is countering it was not classy enough, hence she got him a high quality tailored one. Bond notes this. Vesper counters he is too easy to measure up. - in every sense! I love that scene.
Bond lost the money, after Vesper stole it for Quantum. I believe we see the security case in the water, then subsiquently, after Vesper dies?) White pick it up and walk away. I would not be surprised if the funds transferred for the Bolivia project in QoS come from this funding. But that is wishful guesswork on my part.
Re White at the end of CR-06, although we know QoS is supposed to start immediately after the end of CR-06 we don't know how much time passes between Bond getting the message on Vespers phone while he is talking to M from the yacht in Venice and the subsiquent scene when Bond shoots and captures White overlooking Lake Como. Probably been a couple of days, but it could have been several months or even a year! (M's office does completely change, she replaces Villiers as her PA, Tanner joins the dept at some point, the Prime Minister retires in favour of his deputy*. and Bond has a new Aston!)
* Gordon Brown replacing Tony Blair in reality. Plus the recession hit in 2008 as well. Quantum?
Thunderbird Who? = If the app is invisible, How could he see it to use it? Does not compute.
Okay, so if we go by the dinghy, then Mr. White went to the boat, and the boat took Bond to the Aston Martin. I still don't see why it would be so hard for Bond to park his car hidden nearby. A DBS could most certainly drive on grass. Or maybe he parked it in a neighbor's driveway. An Aston Martin would not be a remarkable site in such a rich area.
There's no way to rationalise the appearance of the Alfa Romeos if the sailboat is Bond's unless Mr. White has a tracking device like Bond's inside him.
Bond has the same Aston Martin in CR and QoS. It would appear he recovers it and has it repaired after the roll.
If they were his "security team" they weren't very good as they let Bond shoot Mr. White and then they watched as Mr. White crawled across the drive and up the steps and Bond unhurriedly introduced himself and then presumably dragged Mr. White to wherever the Aston Martin is hidden (in the woods!), bundle him into the boot, and then drive off.
They must've been on a smoke break.
In their invisible Alfa Romeos.
I think the best explanantion is that the director wanted to have this really cool chase scene even if it broke continuity from the previous movie.
He must have had a security team offsite and didn't want to be bothered by anyone at home. I'd guess M has the same thing and doesn't have a security team living with her.
M's security team was crap. Must have been G4S.
Fraid not. Same model, the V12 DBS, but different cars.
Different colour, different reg plate. CR-06 = TT 378 20. And QoS = 72 GH3LD
Apparently the second one was also in the games Bloodstone and Legends.
I actually didn't realise that the DBS was a different colour. It's so similar!
He also changes suit though Matt, as you know (from your excellent blog), so perhaps some willing suspension of disbelief is required (as per usual).
Daniel Craig changed his suit, but James Bond did not. The similarities between the two outfits mean that QoS outfit is supposed to be the same as the CR outfit, it's just Louise Frogley had different opinions than Lindy Hemming on what Daniel Craig should wear in Italy. The waistcoat was very out-of-place at the end of CR and didn't make sense in the setting. He looks like he's dressed for London. The three-piece suit is supposed to suggest at the end of CR that Bond had matured into the classic Bond, but in QoS he still hadn't changed. The waistcoat was no relevant and the outfit was better without it. The change from Brioni to Tom Ford is less relevant because that's the real world, not Bond's world. Since we're supposed to believe the suits are the same, are we also supposed to believe the cars are too?
What puzzles me is if the account is in Bond's name, how would she be able to withdraw the funds in person?
I could see how she might do it electronically and just have them transferred to White since she now had the password to the account and was responsible for setting it up to begin with, but just waltzing into the bank and withdrawing it? Would any bank, even in Venice, hand over that amount of money in cash without contacting Bond? Also, how much do they keep in their vault? Even in Venice that sounds like a large amount of notes to be kept in a local branch vault. I know a banker and he said that branches usually never keep more than five figures in their branches for insurance reasons.
Yes, I thought the money was transferred into the Treasury account - but it's in Vesper's name, not Bond's...I thought she would be the one to transfer the winnings directly to SIS.
She held onto the money to use it to exchange for Bond's life...
Doubtful. I saw the wrecks of the two Astons side by side at Bond in Motion. The Casino Ice and Quantum Silver colours are distinctly different, as well as the aforementioned reg plates. Plus there is the other blatant differences such as M's office, Bond's build, how long it took to discover the faked corpse of Vesper's boyfriend, etc.
It would have been better if QoS had established that White had been in custody for a month or so, then have Mitchell break him out. His leg could have been treated, it could have established that Quantum does not tell all of its operatives everything (hence White genuinely could not prove any useful info to MI6) and the rest of the story could still continue in the same way. Only with White's escape providing the car chase in Siena, rather than his capture.
Re the Bank account, would it not have been prudent to have a joint account in both Bond and Vesper's names? If Bond was poisoned / ball smacked to death / shot, Vesper would need to have access to get the funds back to the Treasury anyway?
Twice in the film, we see Vesper is Mistress of Coin. - 1) Bond asks her for the other £5 million when he loses. She refuses. - Leiter bails Bond out. 2) In Venice after the bedroom roll-play, Vesper says "I'll get the money, you get the supplies." Implying either of them could access the funds?
As for the - "I'll get the money, you get the supplies" - line...looks to me only Vesper could access the money - which is usual in men/women relationships
If the casino is transferring the winnings to Bond's account, they wouldn't do it if they only had his account number. His name would have to be on that account for verification. It's very strange as Vesper tells Bond on the train the Treasury has created the account for him with the stake money deposited in it. Since this operation was supposed to be secret, they could not officially open the account, so Vesper would have had to open it by telling the bank she was doing it as Bond's representative - in which case she would not have full authority over the funds without Bond's authorization.
I supposed when it comes to shadowy world of MI6 anything is possible...after all they issue him passports and ID for him with fake names and identities (and probably credit cards along with them). So creating an account in a foreign bank would not be a problem for them using Vesper as their agent.
The other interesting thing is the metal briefcase itself. Are we assuming Vesper is carrying $120 m in cash in it? Would that be possible considering how small the case is? Is it more likely that this is the same type of case Mendel was carrying - which actually contains a secure portable hack resistant computer that they give to their millionaire customers that is electronically tied directly to the bank's servers and can be used for no other purpose, so the customer can do transactions from it? I've never hear of a bank doing this, but if access to their high end accounts could only be done through these cases outside the bank itself it would make them much more secure. It would also be easier and safer than trying to tote around that much cash. Without the access code to the account it would be useless to anyone stealing it. Since Vesper presumably already gave Mr. White the code and he had the case afte the palazzo sinking, then he would have transferred the money to a QUANTUM account.
http://geekbeat.tv/how-much-money-will-fit-in-a-briefcase/
So, even if the cash had been in 500 euro notes, it wouldn't have come close to fitting.
I'd always assumed that Vesper had complete access to the account since she was "the money."
Damn you M, - you sank my Bankleship!
It's funny how a point I'd not given any thought to suddenly sparks this discussion
And you made me think, TB2 - now my brain hurts