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Re: Bond's Childhood

You know I've always held you in High Regard, Sir Miles.  ajb007/biggrin
You just keep missing the trap door.  ajb007/tongue   ajb007/wink

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Re: Bond's Childhood

Thunderpussy wrote:

You know I've always held you in High Regard, Sir Miles.  ajb007/biggrin
You just keep missing the trap door.  ajb007/tongue   ajb007/wink

I bet it's the first time someone has told you your trap is too small  ajb007/lol

Scouse not English
The higher the monkey climbs the more you can see its arse

YNWA: Justice For The 96

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ajb007/lol   ajb007/lol   ajb007/lol

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Re: Bond's Childhood

Gassy Man wrote:

I appreciate that, Blackleiter, and the feelings are mutual.  I tend to fall into the "Chekhov's Gun" camp, where if a writer brings something up, he or she should do something meaningful with it.  But you're right that different audiences will have different expectations. 

I still don't quite see why Bond would seek refuge at Skyfall -- the plot intimates that he thinks he will have an advantage of some kind there, but I still can't figure out exactly what it was.  That M dies there doesn't exactly make it seem like a good plan nor a good resolution to Bond's situation except to give reason to introduce the new M. 

What it really feels like is something shoehorned into the plot to give the illusion that Bond's personal and professional lives are intertwined, and that facing one of those issues allows him to face the other.  The construction seems flimsy at best, and only gets flimsier the more I think about it -- the audience has to do most of the work to fill in the blanks.

I guess this is why I am looking so hard for more.  Beyond just fleshing out the ideas the story brings up, more would clarify just what was going on and why.   

Let's say, for instance, that we saw a brief scene after the titles where Kincaid takes Bond hunting as a boy.  Under his tutelage, Bond kills a stag, but he is shaken by the event -- taking a life for the first time.  He wants to talk to his parents, but they are away skiing.  His room is decorated with old tall ships and martial scenes, and we realize that while his childhood is surrounded by images of death, he has never really faced it in any meaningful way.  Let him fall asleep uneasily reading some boy's adventure story that suggests killing is what a man does. 

Later, Kincaid comes to deliver the news to Bond about his parents.  We see the boy Bond immediately know what he's going to say, but before he can say it, Bond retreats to the caves.  There, we see him cry, perhaps for days, and then maybe he swears aloud that he will never allow himself to care for anyone again.  That would be nice because it would dovetail with Bond in Casino Royale being so cold, as well as why he has a love-hate relationship with M, his surrogate mother.  When Bond emerges he is as Kincaid later describes and looks at a concerned Kincaid and says simply, "I'm leaving.  Stay if you want.  But this place is dead to me, and it will always be a place of death."

Later, all the psychobabble about Skyfall with the psychiatrist would make more sense.  So would Bond's lines about "Enjoying death" and his hobby being resurrection.  If they tuned up some of the later dialogue -- Bond could say "Back in time.  Where we'll have the advantage.  Where Silva can face death for a change."

Not great dialogue, I admit, but I'm just saying this for illustration. A better writer would excel.  Maybe an additional five minutes of screen time.  But then I'd see where all of this psychologically was supposed to combine.

Anyway, I just think Skyfall is sloppy.  Sometimes films give us too much and are insulting with pandering.  But Skyfall wants to be more than it is.

Totally see your point on this.  However, we all know that they will never go to that literary depth in this series because it is marketed as an action film series.  If this had been done as a series on HBO, your narrative would perfected be suited - because they do more literate work on television.  I always point this out by illustrating the difference between the way the Hollywood versions of the Sherlock Holmes stories were done as opposed to the literary care they were treated for PBS in the Granada productions.

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Re: Bond's Childhood

Gassy Man wrote:
Blackleiter wrote:
Gassy Man wrote:

I appreciate that, Blackleiter, and the feelings are mutual.  I tend to fall into the "Chekhov's Gun" camp, where if a writer brings something up, he or she should do something meaningful with it.  But you're right that different audiences will have different expectations. 

I still don't quite see why Bond would seek refuge at Skyfall -- the plot intimates that he thinks he will have an advantage of some kind there, but I still can't figure out exactly what it was.  That M dies there doesn't exactly make it seem like a good plan nor a good resolution to Bond's situation except to give reason to introduce the new M. 

What it really feels like is something shoehorned into the plot to give the illusion that Bond's personal and professional lives are intertwined, and that facing one of those issues allows him to face the other.  The construction seems flimsy at best, and only gets flimsier the more I think about it -- the audience has to do most of the work to fill in the blanks.

I guess this is why I am looking so hard for more.  Beyond just fleshing out the ideas the story brings up, more would clarify just what was going on and why.   

Let's say, for instance, that we saw a brief scene after the titles where Kincaid takes Bond hunting as a boy.  Under his tutelage, Bond kills a stag, but he is shaken by the event -- taking a life for the first time.  He wants to talk to his parents, but they are away skiing.  His room is decorated with old tall ships and martial scenes, and we realize that while his childhood is surrounded by images of death, he has never really faced it in any meaningful way.  Let him fall asleep uneasily reading some boy's adventure story that suggests killing is what a man does. 

Later, Kincaid comes to deliver the news to Bond about his parents.  We see the boy Bond immediately know what he's going to say, but before he can say it, Bond retreats to the caves.  There, we see him cry, perhaps for days, and then maybe he swears aloud that he will never allow himself to care for anyone again.  That would be nice because it would dovetail with Bond in Casino Royale being so cold, as well as why he has a love-hate relationship with M, his surrogate mother.  When Bond emerges he is as Kincaid later describes and looks at a concerned Kincaid and says simply, "I'm leaving.  Stay if you want.  But this place is dead to me, and it will always be a place of death."

Later, all the psychobabble about Skyfall with the psychiatrist would make more sense.  So would Bond's lines about "Enjoying death" and his hobby being resurrection.  If they tuned up some of the later dialogue -- Bond could say "Back in time.  Where we'll have the advantage.  Where Silva can face death for a change."

Not great dialogue, I admit, but I'm just saying this for illustration. A better writer would excel.  Maybe an additional five minutes of screen time.  But then I'd see where all of this psychologically was supposed to combine.

Anyway, I just think Skyfall is sloppy.  Sometimes films give us too much and are insulting with pandering.  But Skyfall wants to be more than it is.

I must make this last point - you are a terrific writer! I don't know if the scenario you describe would have worked in the film or not, and I tend to think it would have slowed things down a bit more than I would like. But I'll admit you have done an impressive job of mapping out your vision in just a few sentences. Does EON know about you? ajb007/lol

Haha, thanks.  I teach college writing for a living, among other things.  I've got publications under my belt, though nothing in the movie arena, as well as a successful textbook.  I know screenwriters who tell me about the business, and years ago, I helped some people pitch a movie idea, which came awfully close to making it to the development stage.  I'm in my 40s but may just retire soon -- my second life is going to be devoted to writing novels and, perhaps, screenplays.  I've certainly been studying the craft long enough, but rather than pay my dues through a bunch of odd jobs, I wanted to establish a comfortable life first.  When I get to that point where Hollywood beckons, I'll let you know, haha.

I'll be keeping an eye out for your work (although you'll have to alert me who I should be looking for because I doubt we'll see a credit that reads "Screenplay by Gassy Man"!) ajb007/lol

"Felix Leiter, a brother from Langley."

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Re: Bond's Childhood

ajb007/lol  ajb007/lol

"How was your lamb?" "Skewered. One sympathises."

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John Logan Jr ?  ajb007/lol

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Re: Bond's Childhood

Haha, thanks, you guys are too much.  When the time comes, I'll let you know my real name.

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Re: Bond's Childhood

Gassy Man wrote:

Haha, thanks, you guys are too much.  When the time comes, I'll let you know my real name.

Until then shall we just call you Number 6?  ajb007/bond

"How was your lamb?" "Skewered. One sympathises."

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Re: Bond's Childhood

They've given you a number, and taken away your name.

9 songs done, 2 in various stages of disarray for next album!

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Re: Bond's Childhood

You may have my number, you can take my name, but you'll
Never have my heart !   ajb007/lol

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Re: Bond's Childhood

Haha!  ajb007/cheers

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Re: Bond's Childhood

I see they're having problems with the script ( supposedly  ajb007/lol  ), Now's  the
Chance to offer your services. ajb007/lol , If you could write in a Part for a goodlooking
Bond fan with the initials TP, that would be great !  ajb007/lol

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Re: Bond's Childhood

I didn't know The Pope was a Bond fan. How cool.

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Re: Bond's Childhood

ajb007/lol  Well he does have that special car, but I always thought
that was an homage to the Batmobile.  ajb007/biggrin

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Re: Bond's Childhood

Thunderpussy wrote:

If you could write in a Part for a goodlooking
Bond fan with the initials TP, that would be great !

And for your helpful suggestion, I think he should write a part for you, too, TP! ajb007/lol

"Felix Leiter, a brother from Langley."

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Re: Bond's Childhood

ajb007/lol   ajb007/lol   ajb007/lol
I'm going to have to up my beauty regime  ajb007/biggrin

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Re: Bond's Childhood

Having re-read Octopussy, as a tie in to Bond's childhood. I think they
Could work a version of Bond losing a " Father figure ", giving him a personal
Reason for going after the villain.  ajb007/martini
  As Bond himself says in the book, when asked why he had taken on the mission
Of confronting Major Dexter Smythe, he says of the victim.....
" He was a father figure to me, at a time when I needed one ".  Maybe not right away
As I think Bond has had enough emotional turmoil for a while, but it could be used in
A future film.

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Re: Bond's Childhood

Bond can never have enough Emotional Turmoil ajb007/lol  ajb007/martini

1.On Her Majesties Secret Service 2.The Living Daylights 3.license To Kill 4.The Spy Who Loved Me 5.Goldfinger

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Re: Bond's Childhood

Perhaps a flashback to a young Bond being taught how to
Shoot / ski and chase girls.  ajb007/wink   ajb007/lol