Was Roger Moore a rubbish Bond?

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  • Double 0 ZeroDouble 0 Zero Posts: 30MI6 Agent
    Steed wrote:
    Yes, you look at him in 'The Saint' and to me he's no more jokey in that than Sean was as Bond. I've always considered Simon Templar to be the role Moore was born to play and the role he was probably best in, but had the humour been kept at bay (AND, a lot of the time the REALLY bad humour isn't Roger's either- it's the sight/sound gags like the 'double take pigeon', the stupid sound effect of the car stunt in TMWTTGG, the Tarzan yell) he would have been even better as Bond.

    That's right: not only the scripts but sound effects and editing could really undermine parts of Moore's Bond films.

    I should mention (given your user name) that my brother and I used to play secret agent in the back yard. He would pretend to be Simon Templar and I would be John Steed!

    No wonder Diana Rigg was such a welcome sight to me when I first saw OHMSS as a boy.
  • SteedSteed Posts: 134MI6 Agent
    Diana Rigg is always a welcome sight to my eyes!!:D
  • Agent_0010Agent_0010 Posts: 17MI6 Agent
    Im not sure if I agree with him, but my dad always thought of Roger Moore as "the puny Bond", and my dad said Moore couldn't fight his way out of a wet paperbag.:D I disagree, but Moore is still my least favorite Bond(not saying I don't like Moore, I just don't care for him as Bond too much). However, saying that, LALD is my third favorite Bond film overall, so....:D
  • HankHank Posts: 37MI6 Agent
    I'm glad Moore was Bond because he added a different flavor all together. I don't think any of his Bond movies were great, but when you go back and watch 'em all he takes Bond to a whole other world that's just as fun.

    He fits the movies they made very well.
  • Dan SameDan Same Victoria, AustraliaPosts: 6,057MI6 Agent
    Fish1941 wrote:
    While watching FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE with my sister, she pointed out the numerous times Bond made a quip. And many of them were either lame or simply bad.
    You mean you didn't like such lines as "She had her kicks"? ;)
    "He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
  • DramaqueenDramaqueen Posts: 3MI6 Agent
    My first Bond movie that ever watched was Goldfinger with Sean Connery and it totally blew me away. After that, I was a James Bond fan. My second movie was Octopussy and then I watched a number of Roger moore like live and let die etc and now he is my favourite Bond. Although he may not have the Sean Connery charm, he still seems to captivate me with his humour and simply by the way he plays Bond.

    P.S. I just joined the forum so I would just like to say hello!
  • baccaretbaccaret Posts: 61MI6 Agent
    Moore was not the best bond but some of his movies are great, and when you do seven movies his mark on the series is un mistakable:))
  • La CuranderaLa Curandera Posts: 52MI6 Agent
    I'll preface this by saying that I don't dislike any of the Bonds, they all brought something different to the role. But the Moore era of 007 differs from the rest of the series because of the direction the producers (and Moore) wanted to take the character, resulting in some pretty silly stuff. Like with any Bond, I enjoy the films for what they are, which is a (mostly) lighter, campier Bond.

    My biggest complaint of Moore (aside from "nicing up" the role) isn't his age, as much as it is the physicality of the role. Watching Moore in a foot chase is reminicent of Shatner as TJ Hooker.

    I've always been of the opinion that Roger Moore is to James Bond what Adam West was to Batman... and let it be known that I also love West's portrayal of Batman for what it is: fun.

    So Roger Moore, while not my favorite Bond, still gets love from me, because his were the first 007s I had seen as a child, and that is where I learned to love 007.
  • Harry PalmerHarry Palmer Somewhere in the past ...Posts: 325MI6 Agent
    I do not like Moore, but I can't say he was rubbish. He was a good Bond for his time. But his comedic interpretation has not aged very well.
    1. Cr, 2. Ltk, 3. Tld, 4. Qs, 5. Ohmss, 6. Twine, 7. Tnd, 8. Tswlm, 9. Frwl, 10. Tb, 11. Ge, 12. Gf, 13. Dn, 14. Mr, 15. Op, 16. Yolt, 17. Sf, 18. Daf, 19. Avtak, 20. Sp, 21. Fyeo, 22. Dad, 23. Lald, 24. Tmwtgg
  • SteedSteed Posts: 134MI6 Agent
    There are only some of Roger's films I find campy- two of them were directed by Guy Hamilton, LALD and TMWTTGG, the other being Moonraker. But I personally think the all time campiest Bond film did not star Roger- it was Sean's Diamonds Are Forever. Now, I think it's great fun, but it's pretty much one big joke all the way through. The Connery 'halo effect' often means people ignore such things, imo, and take potshots at Roger for things that appeared earlier in the Connery era anyway.

    Roger is my 2nd fave Bond (after Connery, who definitely does define the part in his early films, imho, in spite of some reservations over one or two films)- I generally love his delivery of the jokes (most of the jokes I dislike in his films aren't from him, they are the sight gags), and he was capable of being tough as well as witty- he manages both wonderfully in FYEO and Octopussy, imho.
  • RJJBRJJB United StatesPosts: 344MI6 Agent
    DAF has been acknowledged as the movie that started the downward spiral. The only reasons I can watch it is because it's a Connery Bond and because I have such great memories of being in Europe when I saw it. I was even in Amsterdam when I saw, even got to see the Skinny Bridge that is mentioned in the movie. The Moore movies were garbage, but DAF was the initial offender. It's hard to believe that the producers could let the series get away from them as badly as they did.
  • LazenbyLazenby The upper reaches of the AmazoPosts: 606MI6 Agent
    To me the Bond actors fall into one of two categories: those I find convincing in the role and those I don't. Roger Moore knew that he couldn't embody the character like Connery could, so he tried to make us laugh instead. I still enjoy some of his movies (MR is my favorite, followed by TSWLM) but a lot of them I can't sit through because the jokes have mostly worn thin and Moore lacked the magnetism that attracts generation after generation to Connery's Bond movies.
  • Dan SameDan Same Victoria, AustraliaPosts: 6,057MI6 Agent
    edited March 2007
    RJJB wrote:
    DAF has been acknowledged as the movie that started the downward spiral. The only reasons I can watch it is because it's a Connery Bond and because I have such great memories of being in Europe when I saw it. I was even in Amsterdam when I saw, even got to see the Skinny Bridge that is mentioned in the movie. The Moore movies were garbage, but DAF was the initial offender. It's hard to believe that the producers could let the series get away from them as badly as they did.
    RJJB, we will never agree, which is fine, and obviously you don't have to respond if you don't want to, but I don't agree at all. Although DAF isn't a particularly great film, I think it has some great things going for it (Connery's performance, Wint + Kidd, the elevator fight, the final scene, Bambi + Thumper, among others.) I also would never describe any of the Moore films (aside from AVTAK) as garbage. When I think of Bondian garbage, I do think of AVTAK, but I also think of TLD and LTK. If with DAF, the producers 'let the series get away from them as badly as they did,' and if that led to LALD, TSWLM, FYEO and OP (and even MR), then I am happy that they did. :D
    "He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
  • ToshTogoToshTogo Rep. of South AfricaPosts: 103MI6 Agent
    I think it would be unfair to say moore was a crap Bond, he was the Bond that i grew up with , and i enjoyed his portrayal.
    His Bond was right for the times, although his films seem a bit silly now, (compared to later Bonds) they are still good enetertainment.
  • Napoleon Han SoloNapoleon Han Solo Posts: 78MI6 Agent
    I really liked La Curandera's mentoning Adam West as Batman in relation to Moore as Bond, I have drawn similar comparisons before. And West is my favourite Batman after Christian Bale (though in all fairness the other actors got chintzed by lousy movies). I like that the same character can be played in a variety of ways.

    I believe TSWLM is a classic movie, a fine action film even outside of it being a Bond. I would say that Craig has done wonderful things with Bond but many of those things were implicit in Moore's performance, such as the cruelty and coldness, just expressed in a different way. IE, with "What a helpful chap" we see the same character we see in CR who smiles when the terrorist blows up. Moore had Bond's smoothness in spades and I actually don't have the problem with his fighting that others do, I think he looks good in fighting in most movies, like TMWTGG. Moore was also probably the closest we'll ever see to Cary Grant playing Bond. (I sometimes fantasize what a Bond movie starring Grant and directed by Hitchcock could have looked like.) The look Bond gives Anya upon his first spotting of Naomi seems very Grant-like to me, but is also classic Moore.

    Times change. In the commentary for TSWLM Moore talks about trying to keep his hair looking good on the jet ski. Nowadays it would be mandatory for it to get messed up, because that's more "realistic." Okay, fine. But there was a time people wanted things to look glamorous, not real. Myself, I like having access to both visions.

    I hope we see several more gritty Craig films as fine or even better than CR. But it's always possible afterward that the taste axis will have shifted back to people wanting something lighter. Hopefully those movies will be done as well as the best Moores were done. {[]
  • RJJBRJJB United StatesPosts: 344MI6 Agent
    edited March 2007
    RJJB, we will never agree, which is fine, and obviously you don't have to respond if you don't want to, but I don't agree at all. Although DAF isn't a particularly great film, I think it has some great things going for it (Connery's performance, Wint + Kidd, the elevator fight, the final scene, Bambi + Thumper, among others.) I also would never describe any of the Moore films (aside from AVTAK) as garbage. When I think of Bondian garbage, I do think of AVTAK, but I also think of TLD and LTK. If with DAF, the producers 'let the series get away from them as badly as they did,' and if that led to LALD, TSWLM, FYEO and OP (and even MR), then I am happy that they did. :D

    No doubt, Dan, my disdain for the Roger Moore movies stems from the fact that for the most part, I've seen the movies in the theater, in the order in which they were released. So I saw how good the series started with the first four movies, saw its weakening with YOLT, and its resurgence with OHMSS. When I saw DAF, I could not believe that James Bond had sunk so low.
    Yes it was good to have Connery back, and the point you mentioned are all good ones with one exception: Bambi and Thumper. Sorry, but the characters' names grate on me. Bond movies are always supposed to set a trend, never follow or reference any other movies. So the cute little nod to Disney characters is out of place.

    I think DAF started out great with the diamond pipeline plot and was on track until the action shifted to Las Vegas. At that point, production values took a dive and the movie looks more like a television production than the expensive Bond production it should be. I disliked Jill St. John as Tiffany Case, probably for the equal reasons that she was not as alluring as her European predecessors, plus her character is so poorly written. "Blow it up your pants!" What a great line. Felix Leiter is another poorly cast character, menat to like somewhat of a buffoon compared to Bond Add to the mix a truly ridiculous Blofeld and the movie's fate is sealed, in terms of characterization.

    The introduction of the satellite with its deathray is just so wrong for a James Bond movie, especially when it is done as cheesy as it is in DAF. The special effects consisting of targets being irradiated, glowing red and then blowing up smack of 1950s sci-fi B movies.

    As to my disdain for Roger Moore: he lacks some may of the attributes that Bond is supposed to have. First, he is no physical threat. You can never convince me that this guy would ever be able to fight his way out of a paper bag, let alone against the people he physically fought. In fairness to RM, he had a good beginning scene in the climax of LALD when he first squared off against Kananga. There was enough of a wise-ass smirk on his face that he briefly showed some grit. And I will admit his kicking Locgue's car over the cliff in FYEO was a good scene. But I have to laugh when Zorin's screen display lists him as being extremely dangerous in AVTAK. Yeah, he's dangerous if you happen to trip over him. And let's not forget the wonderful scene in Octopussy when RM can't get the German woman out of the phone booth. Yeah, this guy supposedly fought Oddjob, Grant,etc., there's an atomic bomb going to be detonated and an ordinary woman stops him from using the phone. Obviously all the seemingly invulnerable henchmen were the wrong way to go. The main villians should have surrounded themselves with innocent housewives as their main line of defense.

    Moore never convincingly moves with any sense of urgency. He walks through his scenes with a cavalier tone that does not make you feel that he is using his skills. Nor does he ever convey any decent amount of anger. When he tries to sound tough, as he does in TMWTGG when he (disguised as Scaramanga) describes himself as "good, even by my standards" I have to laugh.
    Toughness is not one of Moore's strong suits.

    And you can not convince me that women actually swoon over RM. The man has no sexual chemistry with any of his leading ladies. His entire demeanor is from the school of "nudge, nudge, wink, wink", along the lines of dirty little school boy. Bond's interactions with women are supposed to be cool. RM just makes them seem cheap.

    Moore's delivery of the one liners is also poor, probably because the lines themselves are so lousy. "He always had an over-inflated opionion of himself", "There's no sense going off half cocked", "What a helpful chap", "I discovered he had a crush on me". Just a few examples of cringe-worthy comments. Of course, the bad writing is no exclusive to the Moore movies, but that is no defense for his horrible delivery.

    After all this bile, I would like to say there is one thing at which the Moore movies excel. At times, I have trouble falling asleep at night and sometimes I need to put on a movie to knock me out. The best sleep inducing tape I have is TSWLM. I never last more than 2 minutes once I pop that movie into the VCR. So in this instance, it's true. Nobody does it better.
  • Napoleon Han SoloNapoleon Han Solo Posts: 78MI6 Agent
    RJJB wrote:
    And you can not convince me that women actually swoon over RM. The man has no sexual chemistry with any of his leading ladies. His entire demeanor is from the school of "nudge, nudge, wink, wink", along the lines of dirty little school boy. Bond's interactions with women are supposed to be cool. RM just makes them seem cheap.

    Moore's delivery of the one liners is also poor, probably because the lines themselves are so lousy. "He always had an over-inflated opionion of himself", "There's no sense going off half cocked", "What a helpful chap", "I discovered he had a crush on me". Just a few examples of cringe-worthy comments. Of course, the bad writing is no exclusive to the Moore movies, but that is no defense for his horrible delivery.

    After all this bile, I would like to say there is one thing at which the Moore movies excel. At times, I have trouble falling asleep at night and sometimes I need to put on a movie to knock me out. The best sleep inducing tape I have is TSWLM. I never last more than 2 minutes once I pop that movie into the VCR. So in this instance, it's true. Nobeody does it better.

    Haha, tell us what you really think. I definitely love to hear people disagree with me when they put it creatively and humorously. I'm secure enough in my own opinions I don't need people agreeing with me, it's always good to see what an intelligent bunch Bond fans are. You supported your arguments well which I appreciate because I certainly think that the style of posting that people still make on some forums like "'Blank' is lame. It just is" has gotten passe, we've had the internet long enough for people to be a little more mature. So a sincere thanks.

    And actually I can support your statement on Moore's sex appeal by saying that my mom recently said she never found him attractive. However, I have also seen lusting posts on his fan myspace from girls who are currently teenagers. I would say that strangely the part of me that appreciates Moore's Bond is related to that inner 14 year old who listens to early Beastie Boys or AC/DC. The fact that his threats never seem that threatening and the sex comes easy appeals to a teenage side of me. But well, when I'm in the mood nothing does it better.
  • Agent SidewinderAgent Sidewinder Posts: 223MI6 Agent
    Funny how people always bring up the fact that Moore never looks threatening as Bond. I think that actually makes him more threatening - I mean, take a look at Connery - the minute you see him, you KNOW he's a threat. But with Roger you'd never suspect...until it's too late.
  • Napoleon Han SoloNapoleon Han Solo Posts: 78MI6 Agent
    See yeah, I actually do agree with that...when I said that about his threats less threatening I mean in how he is perceived. But yes, I too think that it's better for Bond to not look threatening. How many serial killers are people that other people thought were harmless, until they were found out? It's quite possible Jack the Ripper in civilian life had mannerisms similar to Moore, smooth, debonair and so forth.

    To draw a comparison to a different movie franchise, my favourite Hannibal Lecter was Brian Cox. If anyone acted around me the way Anthony Hopkins' Lecter did I'd give him a wide berth. Cox on the other hand didn't play it scary, so you wouldn't realize he was a threat.
  • OdowanOdowan Posts: 20MI6 Agent
    He's certainly not my favorite, but that may be more an issue of the scripts than his performance. When given good material, he can be great such as in For Your Eyes Only.
  • LoeffelholzLoeffelholz The United States, With LovePosts: 8,864Quartermasters
    Odowan wrote:
    He's certainly not my favorite, but that may be more an issue of the scripts than his performance. When given good material, he can be great such as in For Your Eyes Only.

    Welcome to AJB, Odowan {[] You'll have a great time here.

    You'll also find that each of the Bond actors has a very dedicated group of aficionados/defenders...
    "Blood & Ashes"...AVAILABLE on Amazon.co.uk: Get 'Jaded': Blood & Ashes: The Debut Oscar Jade Thriller
    "I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
    "Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
  • cosmocosmo Posts: 52MI6 Agent
    RJJB wrote:
    And you can not convince me that women actually swoon over RM. The man has no sexual chemistry with any of his leading ladies. His entire demeanor is from the school of "nudge, nudge, wink, wink", along the lines of dirty little school boy. Bond's interactions with women are supposed to be cool. RM just makes them seem cheap.

    Moore's delivery of the one liners is also poor, probably because the lines themselves are so lousy. "He always had an over-inflated opionion of himself", "There's no sense going off half cocked", "What a helpful chap", "I discovered he had a crush on me". Just a few examples of cringe-worthy comments. Of course, the bad writing is no exclusive to the Moore movies, but that is no defense for his horrible delivery.

    After all this bile, I would like to say there is one thing at which the Moore movies excel. At times, I have trouble falling asleep at night and sometimes I need to put on a movie to knock me out. The best sleep inducing tape I have is TSWLM. I never last more than 2 minutes once I pop that movie into the VCR. So in this instance, it's true. Nobeody does it better.

    Haha, tell us what you really think. I definitely love to hear people disagree with me when they put it creatively and humorously. I'm secure enough in my own opinions I don't need people agreeing with me, it's always good to see what an intelligent bunch Bond fans are. You supported your arguments well which I appreciate because I certainly think that the style of posting that people still make on some forums like "'Blank' is lame. It just is" has gotten passe, we've had the internet long enough for people to be a little more mature. So a sincere thanks.

    And actually I can support your statement on Moore's sex appeal by saying that my mom recently said she never found him attractive. However, I have also seen lusting posts on his fan myspace from girls who are currently teenagers. I would say that strangely the part of me that appreciates Moore's Bond is related to that inner 14 year old who listens to early Beastie Boys or AC/DC. The fact that his threats never seem that threatening and the sex comes easy appeals to a teenage side of me. But well, when I'm in the mood nothing does it better.
  • cosmocosmo Posts: 52MI6 Agent
    RJJB wrote:
    And you can not convince me that women actually swoon over RM. The man has no sexual chemistry with any of his leading ladies. His entire demeanor is from the school of "nudge, nudge, wink, wink", along the lines of dirty little school boy. Bond's interactions with women are supposed to be cool. RM just makes them seem cheap.

    Moore's delivery of the one liners is also poor, probably because the lines themselves are so lousy. "He always had an over-inflated opionion of himself", "There's no sense going off half cocked", "What a helpful chap", "I discovered he had a crush on me". Just a few examples of cringe-worthy comments. Of course, the bad writing is no exclusive to the Moore movies, but that is no defense for his horrible delivery.

    After all this bile, I would like to say there is one thing at which the Moore movies excel. At times, I have trouble falling asleep at night and sometimes I need to put on a movie to knock me out. The best sleep inducing tape I have is TSWLM. I never last more than 2 minutes once I pop that movie into the VCR. So in this instance, it's true. Nobeody does it better.

    Haha, tell us what you really think. I definitely love to hear people disagree with me when they put it creatively and humorously. I'm secure enough in my own opinions I don't need people agreeing with me, it's always good to see what an intelligent bunch Bond fans are. You supported your arguments well which I appreciate because I certainly think that the style of posting that people still make on some forums like "'Blank' is lame. It just is" has gotten passe, we've had the internet long enough for people to be a little more mature. So a sincere thanks.

    And actually I can support your statement on Moore's sex appeal by saying that my mom recently said she never found him attractive. However, I have also seen lusting posts on his fan myspace from girls who are currently teenagers. I would say that strangely the part of me that appreciates Moore's Bond is related to that inner 14 year old who listens to early Beastie Boys or AC/DC. The fact that his threats never seem that threatening and the sex comes easy appeals to a teenage side of me. But well, when I'm in the mood nothing does it better.
    :))so do you like rodger,or not?
  • cosmocosmo Posts: 52MI6 Agent
    whether you liked roger moore or not,he certainly looked the part(by that i mean young enough)up to tswlm or at a push mr.however by fyeo he was looking a bit old and that should have been his swansong.i know a lot of you seem to like octopussy,and i thought it was alright when it first came out,but i tried to watch it a few weeks ago when it was on tv and it was awful.in fact i switched off halfway through.i've never done that before with any james bond film,and i don't think i would with any of the other films.
    two questions:for those of you who like op.why?
    and secondly;is there any jb film you honestly could not watch all the way through?
  • BarbelBarbel ScotlandPosts: 31,514Chief of Staff
    cosmo wrote:
    two questions:for those of you who like op.why?
    and secondly;is there any jb film you honestly could not watch all the way through?

    1)
    (a)OP uses Bond plot #2 (Someone is smuggling something- could be gold/diamonds/microchips but here it's Faberge eggs. Turns out this is only "the tip of the tentacle" and a dastardly scheme is afoot.) which allows a build-up as 007 uncovers the plot along with the audience. Some of the detail is a bit fudged but the gradual increase in tension is well-handled. There's even a little Fleming in there for the faithful.

    (b) Moore is on good form; Louis Jourdan makes an excellent villain; the women are sexy; the minor characters are believable.

    (c) The locales are interesting and well presented. India makes a great setting for the bulk of the plot.

    (d) Last but not least: John Barry did the music. It's not his best, but nobody does it better. B-)

    2)
    Absolutely not. Obviously some are better than others!
  • Dan SameDan Same Victoria, AustraliaPosts: 6,057MI6 Agent
    edited March 2007
    RJJB wrote:
    Yes it was good to have Connery back, and the point you mentioned are all good ones with one exception: Bambi and Thumper. Sorry, but the characters' names grate on me. Bond movies are always supposed to set a trend, never follow or reference any other movies. So the cute little nod to Disney characters is out of place.
    You may not like the names (I personally don't mind them) but how can you not like these two beautiful and flexible women? :o
    RJJB wrote:
    As to my disdain for Roger Moore: he lacks some may of the attributes that Bond is supposed to have. First, he is no physical threat. You can never convince me that this guy would ever be able to fight his way out of a paper bag, let alone against the people he physically fought.
    I disagree. I think he was a very good fighter. Look at some of the fights in TMWTGG and TSWLM. He may not have been the best fighter of the Bonds but I think he was a very underrated and convincing fighter.
    RJJB wrote:
    Nor does he ever convey any decent amount of anger. When he tries to sound tough, as he does in TMWTGG when he (disguised as Scaramanga) describes himself as "good, even by my standards" I have to laugh.
    Toughness is not one of Moore's strong suits.
    Again, I disagree. Moore killed a man in cold blood twice in TSWLM, kicked a car off a cliff in FYEO and and was quite ruthless towars the end in OP. I think that Moore was an extremely tough Bond.
    RJJB wrote:
    And you can not convince me that women actually swoon over RM. The man has no sexual chemistry with any of his leading ladies. His entire demeanor is from the school of "nudge, nudge, wink, wink", along the lines of dirty little school boy. Bond's interactions with women are supposed to be cool. RM just makes them seem cheap.
    Interesting. I myself am more convinced that women would swoon over Moore than they would Craig. It probably doesn't mean much, but more of the women that I know have swooned over Moore than have swooned over Craig. Additionally, I think that in LALD and STWLM, Moore displayed tremendous sexual chemistry (more so than Dalton and Craig IMO).
    RJJB wrote:
    Moore's delivery of the one liners is also poor, probably because the lines themselves are so lousy. "He always had an over-inflated opionion of himself", "There's no sense going off half cocked", "What a helpful chap", "I discovered he had a crush on me". Just a few examples of cringe-worthy comments. Of course, the bad writing is no exclusive to the Moore movies, but that is no defense for his horrible delivery.
    I disagree for two reasons: One I think that some of the one-liners were great ("He always had an over-inflated opionion of himself" being an example) but also, among all the Bonds, only Connery IMO delivered one-liners better than Moore.

    I guess this shows that we will never agree on Moore. Ah well, at least we both love GF! :D -{
    "He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
  • RJJBRJJB United StatesPosts: 344MI6 Agent
    edited March 2007
    Dan Same wrote:
    RJJB wrote:
    As to my disdain for Roger Moore: he lacks some may of the attributes that Bond is supposed to have. First, he is no physical threat. You can never convince me that this guy would ever be able to fight his way out of a paper bag, let alone against the people he physically fought.
    I disagree. I think he was a very good fighter. Look at some of the fights in TMWTGG and TSWLM. He may not have been the best fighter of the Bonds but I think he was a very underrated and convincing fighter.
    RJJB wrote:
    Nor does he ever convey any decent amount of anger. When he tries to sound tough, as he does in TMWTGG when he (disguised as Scaramanga) describes himself as "good, even by my standards" I have to laugh.
    Toughness is not one of Moore's strong suits.
    Again, I disagree. Moore killed a man in cold blood twice in TSWLM, kicked a car off a cliff in FYEO and and was quite ruthless towars the end in OP. I think that Moore was an extremely tough Bond.

    Sorry, but Moore never seemed believeable in the orchestrated fight scenes. So lacking a physical presence and basic toughness, when he does manage to get the upper hand, it seems forced and unreal to me.
    RJJB wrote:
    And you can not convince me that women actually swoon over RM. The man has no sexual chemistry with any of his leading ladies. His entire demeanor is from the school of "nudge, nudge, wink, wink", along the lines of dirty little school boy. Bond's interactions with women are supposed to be cool. RM just makes them seem cheap.
    Dan Same wrote:
    Interesting. I myself am more convinced that women would swoon over Moore than they would Craig. It probably doesn't mean much, but more of the women that I know have swooned over Moore than have swooned over Craig. Additionally, I think that in LALD and STWLM, Moore displayed tremendous sexual chemistry (more so than Dalton and Craig IMO).

    Nowhere in my discussion is there any mention of comparing Moore to anyone else. It's not a good defense and does nothing to alter my opinion that Moore has no believable chemistry with women in the movies. The only female who seems to be genuinely attracted to him is Bibi Dahl.
    And most of the women I know all never thought that Moore was any kind of sex symbol. To them he was extremely non-descript.
    RJJB wrote:
    Moore's delivery of the one liners is also poor, probably because the lines themselves are so lousy. "He always had an over-inflated opionion of himself", "There's no sense going off half cocked", "What a helpful chap", "I discovered he had a crush on me". Just a few examples of cringe-worthy comments. Of course, the bad writing is no exclusive to the Moore movies, but that is no defense for his horrible delivery.
    I disagree for two reasons: One I think that some of the one-liners were great ("He always had an over-inflated opionion of himself" being an example) but also, among all the Bonds, only Connery IMO delivered one-liners better than Moore.

    Kanaga's final exit ranks as one of the worst scenes ever in a Bond movie. It's is completely impossible for it to have happened the way it did. It belonged in a Road Runner cartoon, not a James Bond movie. The amount of oxygen in that pellet would not be enough to inflate anything as large as a human body. Also, Not only would the human body be unable to stretch and inflate the way it did, Kanaga's explosion was far too clean. No guts.
    The scene is so poorly done and laughable that any tension developed in the scene is gone. So when Moore makes his supposedly witty observation, it just adds to the groan. There is no hint of irony, just a tone of forced humor.
  • Dan SameDan Same Victoria, AustraliaPosts: 6,057MI6 Agent
    edited March 2007
    RJJB wrote:
    Kanaga's final exit ranks as one of the worst scenes ever in a Bond movie. It's is completely impossible for it to have happened the way it did. It belonged in a Road Runner cartoon, not a James Bond movie. The amount of oxygen in that pellet would not be enough to inflate anything as large as a human body. Also, Not only would the human body be unable to stretch and inflate the way it did, Kanaga's explosion was far too clean. No guts.
    The scene is so poorly done and laughable that any tension developed in the scene is gone. So when Moore makes his supposedly witty observation, it just adds to the groan. There is no hint of irony, just a tone of forced humor.
    I liked that line (as I felt it was appropiate to the scene and I also think it fit Kananga perfectly), but I agree that it was a ridiculous way for Kananga to die. :# I love LALD, but I really wish that the manner of Kananga's death was a little less absurd.
    "He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
  • SteedSteed Posts: 134MI6 Agent
    Yeah, I agree. I'm sorry to say I always laugh at Roger's 'inflated opinion of himself' line, but it truly is a stupid demise- this is typical of the Guy Hamilton Bond films of the 70s, with very poor death scenes for villains.
  • Dan SameDan Same Victoria, AustraliaPosts: 6,057MI6 Agent
    Steed wrote:
    Yeah, I agree. I'm sorry to say I always laugh at Roger's 'inflated opinion of himself' line, but it truly is a stupid demise- this is typical of the Guy Hamilton Bond films of the 70s, with very poor death scenes for villains.
    DAF didn't really have a death scene for the villains. ;) (At least not for Blofeld.)
    "He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
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