Was Roger Moore a rubbish Bond?

Okay, first things first, Moore was MY favourite Bond. But there are other people who think he was pretty awful. Too old, too much comedy, didn't look the part, wasn't fit enough, sleepwalked most his films, too wooden, storylines too far fetched, etc.

So are you a Moore hater? If so speak now or forever hold your piece.
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Comments

  • Hugo DraxHugo Drax Leeds, United Kingdom.Posts: 210MI6 Agent
    It always surprises me why age is such an issue for some people. Roger obviously aged in the role, but so did Connery- look at DAF and NSNA. I have never been bothered by the apperance of any Bond in any film.

    Roger Moore is my favourite Bond as well.
  • A7ceA7ce Birmingham, EnglandPosts: 634MI6 Agent
    do we seem to be answering/discussing the same questions every 2 weeks

    dont things like
    Is Roger Moore a good Bond /Bad Bond /
    Who was the Best Bond
    What have u got against Roger Moore - All mean the same thing???
  • jjmacjjmac Posts: 20MI6 Agent
    Once again Drax has it for me.
    If moore was 'far too old' then surely the difference between the right age and too old is say, 10 years...
    If that was is the case Pierce is too old already!
  • Red GrantRed Grant Posts: 147MI6 Agent
    Roger was a great Bond, and perfected the suave, smooth 007 we all know and love. But for me, his films did just not make the cut.
  • trevelyantrevelyan Posts: 1MI6 Agent
    I don't think Moore was horrible as Bond, but I do believe he was too old. Why do I think so? He just looked it and I had a very difficult time believing he could bed as many women as he did in his age, especially with most of the women staying well within the late 20's-early 30's range. You have to remember that Moore is actually 3 years older than Connery, and starting from For Your Eyes Only, it is obvious that Connery was the one that aged more gracefully.

    All in all, I think Moore did an admirable job, but I do not like many of the Moore-era films, but that's mostly to blame on the time period and not the actor.
  • Napoleon PluralNapoleon Plural LondonPosts: 9,116MI6 Agent
    Remember that in the 1970s and 80s the average age of the leading man was older than it is now. We're looking at guys in their 40s like Redford, Newman, McQueen. Now it's all, Matt Damon and Ben Affleck and Leo, so Moore now looks even older than he did back then in comparison.

    I mean, I was shocked at how old Connery looked in NSNA when it came on tv recently. Like Fred Astaire in his older films, sort of toupeed and rickety at times.

    As for Moore, I grew up with his stuff and his films have an enjoyable, Disneyish sense of fun about them. But he now he seems awfully camp in some of his films, with a very arch delivery. Still, for me his films displaced or supplanted the Connery classics in a way that the Brosnan films should have too, but didn't imo.
    "This is where we leave you Mr Bond."

    Roger Moore 1927-2017
  • barracudabarracuda CataloniaPosts: 97MI6 Agent
    Roger Moore would have been ok, but for two things; he didn´t take the role seriously enough and had terrible scripts. The first Bond I saw was TMWTGG, which was great when I was 8 or 9, but now... he just didn´t quite make it as Bond.
    'Yes, dammit, I said "was". The bitch is dead now.'
    The James Bond Dossier | SPECTRE | Q-Branch James Bond Podcast
  • markusmarkus Posts: 1MI6 Agent
    I think Moore was a Great Bond and didnt look to old in his earlier films but in AVTAK he looked very old and worn out
  • Hugo DraxHugo Drax Leeds, United Kingdom.Posts: 210MI6 Agent
    Quoting barracuda:Roger Moore would have been ok, but for two things; he didn´t take the role seriously enough and had terrible scripts. The first Bond I saw was TMWTGG, which was great when I was 8 or 9, but now... he just didn´t quite make it as Bond.

    That's precisely why I like him. He could have a laugh at himself and never took Bond too seriously, realising that this was the best way to play an improbable secret agent.

    And Moore looked better in Octopussy and A View to a Kill than SC did in Diamonds are Forever (aged 40 compared to Moore's 55 and 57 respectively.) I don't remember Moore having grey hair and wearing toupees.
  • spiderfrommarsspiderfrommars Posts: 13MI6 Agent
    Yeah, to be fair to Moore, he did look good for his age. What I also love about Moore is that he is so self-deprecating. He would be the first person to say that he was the worst Bond. He also says "I don't believe in heroes" so he put his own comedy spin on it.

    I also think Moore was a very good actor, though Bond didn't showcase his greatest talents. Even more importantly, if Moore hadn't come along when he did, the Bond franchise would be long long dead.
  • Thomas CrownThomas Crown Posts: 119MI6 Agent
    Roger Moore is my least favorite 007, and age is the icing on the cake when it comes to reasons. While I, and every other Bond fan, should give him credit for sheparding the series through a decade and a half, expanding its fan base, and proving 007 can exsist without Sean Connery, I don't believe, as the saying goes, the juice was worth the squeeze.

    In order to continue the series, and adapt it to the times, the series took a turn towards black exploitation with Live And Let Die, a forced serious that's nothing short of pathetic in The Man With The Golden Gun, over the top sillyness in Moonraker and Octopussy, and a complete lack of orginality in A View To A Kill. I spared The Spy Who Loved Me and For Your Eyes Only as they are the two Bond films of the Moore era to succeed as films, maintain the spirit of Fleming's 007 and the earliest films in addition to being unique and distinctive in their own right. In spite of these two films however, this era represents a drastic course change in the series that took us far away from what Ian Fleming, or the inital films were shooting for. Perhaps I'm just playing Monday-Morning Quarterback here, but I'd rather have taken a few shots at the box office for authenticity's sake than a large tone shift that would alter the perception of the series to this day.

    All of this certainly is not Moore's fault, and much of the blame can be given to the directors and screen writers of the era. However, Roger Moore endorsed this kind of 007 because it played to his own strength as an actor, sophisticated comedy. Moore is not a bad actor, but he is not 007. The teenage-like horny-ness he dispays in attempting to court Goodnight is pathetic, and only a complete bimbo like Goodnight would fall for it. Mostly however, I could never take Moore seriously because he never took himself seriously. Granted, to paraphrase Sean Connery, Bond isn't shakespeare, but that doesn't mean he is a joke either. For someone who is supposed to be a killer, and a trained assasin with emotions and an enigma, Moore's Bond comes off as a self-parody rather than a different but equal interpretation of the role.

    Honestly, I would have preferred Lazenby stayed. I know the box office would have suffered, and perhaps the films wouldn't have garnered the mass audience following some of the later Moore films did, but it's not like Live And Let Die and The Man With The Golden Gun were all that successful with the tone they had. Had Lazenby stayed, the public would have eventually accepted him as 007, especially if Diamonds Are Forver was transformed into a serious revenge thriller. Who knows what would have happened then? After all, Lazenby would have been young enough to play Bond until the mid-1980's, and Dalton could have then followed him.

    I realize I have the advantage of analyzing history after it's happened, but that senario is just too tempting to not contemplate.
  • Hot4DominoHot4Domino Posts: 3MI6 Agent
    Everyone has their take on the different Bonds, which is to expected when you've seen 5 (now 6) actors play the role.

    I think many of our opinions are based on who we first saw play the role. I was 10 when "The Spy Who Loved Me" came out, and it was the first Bond movie I saw...and I absolutely loved it. Roger was part of the reason, and he was who I saw as Bond for many years. As for his age, he was looking pretty old by FYEO, but having just watched DAF, Connery looked absolutely horrible (toupee and belly) when he left the EON series.

    I think every actor had his strengths and weaknesses, and I also believe the series actually would have died by now if every Bond played it exactly as Connery had. Connery may have provided the best overall balance, but I also will maintain until I die that he could not have played Bond in the version of OHMSS that we have all seen (and in my case, made my favorite Bond film). By the time it came out, he and his Bond persona were far too cynical to fall in love. Roger was the most comical, but when push came to shove, he could be very serious if necessary (just ask the guy in the car rolling down the mountain in FYEO). And let's face it, he had some really bad material with which to work (TMWTGG, AVTAK). Brosnan is probably the smoothest of the first five, Dalton is the most intense (and may actually be the best actor of the bunch), and Lazenby was amazing in the fight sequences. So, all of them gave us something special.

    Rubbish? I could never say that about any of them. Some of the films maybe, but not the actors.
  • highhopeshighhopes Posts: 1,358MI6 Agent
    I'm in the habit of referring to "Moore's Bond" as my least favorite and making fun of it. But it's really not Moore himself but the material he had to work with. When you're handed a script with some of the nonsense he had to deal with, it's hard to play it straight -- as he himself has suggested. Dalton tried, oh-so-seriously sliding down the mountain in a cello case. Didn't work either as far as I'm concerned.
    One of my favorite shows on TV as a kid was "The Saint," and when Connery left Bondhood, Moore seemed like a natural to replace him. If the scripts had been more serious, like "The Saint" or Connery's Bonds, I think Moore would have been just fine.
  • LoeffelholzLoeffelholz The United States, With LovePosts: 8,854Quartermasters
    I'll always have respect and gratitude for what Moore did---which was keep the franchise alive. True, he's my least favourite Bond, but I never missed any of his films, and I'm glad I didn't. He had many fine moments in the role.

    I'm a fan of Roger Moore---the Saint, Beau Maverick, Ffolkes...and especially as Sean in The Wild Geese. I wish he'd played Bond that way---or rather, that the era of his tenure would have allowed him to.

    But not rubbish. Never rubbish ;)
    "Blood & Ashes"...AVAILABLE on Amazon.co.uk: Get 'Jaded': Blood & Ashes: The Debut Oscar Jade Thriller
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  • Brosnan_fanBrosnan_fan Sydney, AustraliaPosts: 521MI6 Agent
    Moore was most definitely NOT a "rubbish" Bond; he brought his own style and a refreshing sense of humour to the franchise.

    I grew up during Moore's era, and I enjoy most of his Bond films, although I must say that he was too old by the time of AVTAK and he should not have done that film.
    "Well, he certainly left with his tails between his legs."
  • KGB with loveKGB with love Posts: 18MI6 Agent
    The Moore bond introduced me into 007 world, so i can't say his play is rubbish, becouse it ain't. Once i thought he was best bond actor becouse of his leussure style, but as i grown older i was introduced to other bond actors and now i think Connery is best bond. When i want to just relax i put Moore films, they are best for that. my top Moore movies are FYEO and TSWLM
  • Dan SameDan Same Victoria, AustraliaPosts: 6,057MI6 Agent
    I think Moore was a brilliant Bond and the third best of all, behind only Connery and Brosnan. Additionally, I consider his era to be the 'silver' era; the 'golden' era being the 60's. Moore IMO made four classic Bond films; LALD, TSWLM (the greatest non-Connery film of all time IMO), FYEO and OP. Of his other three films, MR had a terrific first half and was just a really fun film and TMWGG featured several elements (among them the sexual ruthlessness and Christopher Lee's performance) whih I consider to be terrific. The sole exception is AVTAK, which I think would have been a disaster regardless of who starred in it.

    It seems that people often have the same general criticisms of Moore; he wasn't tough/ruthless enough, he didn't take the role seriously enough and he was too camp/self-parodic. I completely disagree with these criticisms. I don't think he was either camp or self-parodic. Nor do I think he failed to take the role seriously. It is true that he was more relaxed, and perhaps even more fun, than someone like Dalton, but I was always more convinced that Moore was James Bond than Dalton or Lazenby. Additionally, in terms of tughness/ruthlessness, Moore was arguably among the most ruthless of all Bonds. LALD, TMWTG, TSWLM and FYEO are testament to this. Also, while Moore wasn't among the toughest of the Bonds, I think he was very tough, but more importantly, I think he was convincingly tough. I don't have a problem with the way Moore played Bond because IMO he, along with Brosnan and Connery, understood that Bond is a ruthless spy but he is also a gentleman. It is Moore's combination of suaveness and ruthlessness that IMO makes him a legend.
    "He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
  • markdownmarkdown Posts: 47MI6 Agent
    no not by a long way.although he is far from being my favourite bond i always enjoyed his bond films and i think i must have seen OP more than any other bond.people particularly critics always knock his acting ability but to me he just played to his strengths,a talent for comedy and his own natural charm. also i don't think his performances could ever be described as a parody, rather that, in real life he seems quite self deprecating in his humour and i think he took that into bond. finally if he had tried to play the connery way that would never have worked for him or the series and he had to have his own style, and as brosnan has demonstrated with his woeful attempts to copy moore,when it comes to playing a lighter less serious bond nobody did it better.
  • SteedSteed Posts: 134MI6 Agent
    No, he certainly wasn't rubbish. In my opinion, Moore was as good as the material he was given.

    Look at him in 'The Spy Who Loved Me', 'For Your Eyes Only' and 'Octopussy', for me his three best and my favourites of his. In those, he takes proceedings seriously, making for a far more satisfying film. Of course, there are jokes, but most Bond films had humour in- that's part of the appeal.

    He's also terrific in his first 'Live and Let Die'. Though sillier than almost every film that went before it, he marks his territory out clearly there. However, it's probably his first film that was the jokiest.

    His other films are less exceptional. 'A View To A Kill' I don't mind and it's inoffensive really, but the other two are probably the nadir of all Bond films. I watched them again recently and my opinion still hasn't changed.
    'The Man With The Golden Gun' is clear evidence, imo, of how Moore's own performance is affected by the scripts. In the first half, he is hard edged and no nonsense. In the second half though, it's a different story with bad jokes and relentless silliness- mainly because the film takes a nosedive with the Kung Fu school scene and it's duff thereafter.

    'Moonraker' he just seems to be sleepwalking. He barely even registers due to the spectacle and bombast of that affair, and even his one liners are mostly not in evidence. This is probably the film he seems wooden most, because to me, he's actually not given too much to do.

    This is a big issue for me as a fan of Moore's that people say he was not a good actor. In the three favourites I mention, he is as good as any Bond before or after him.

    And as has already been said, Moore to me only looked old in AVTAK. Roger was older when he joined than Connery was when he did DAF- who looked older at that point? It's remarkable Roger managed to look as good as he did for so long. Incidentally, on the 1987 'Happy Anniversary 007' documentary, bizarrely he looks better in that than he did two years earlier on AVTAK!

    What's more, Moore is a great ambassador for the films. He took time out to do commentaries for all seven of his films (which I've really enjoyed of the ones I've done so far), and has done numerous commentaries/documentaries for other shows and films he's been in. A man that puts so much effort in celebrating what he did for the fans benefit shouldn't be criticised, imo. No other Bond so far has done so much retrospectively.
  • Moore Not LessMoore Not Less Posts: 1,095MI6 Agent
    edited November 2006
    Memories of 1973 to 1985.

    Voodoo, blaxploitation, "Names is for tombstones, baby", "half-cocked", J W Pepper, Nick Nack, slide whistle, karate girls, "Keeping the British end up", double take pigeon, Bondola, Jaws, Dolly, love, Bond in space, laser battle, "I think he's attempting re-entry", Bald headed man dropped down a chimney stack, Bibi Dahl, ice cream, parrot, Margaret Thatcher, mini-jet emerging from a fake horses ass, gorilla suit, clown suit, safar suits, Tarzan yells, "That's my little Octopussy", Beach Boys, quiche, Dick Tracy, fire truck, "James! James! Don't leave me!", "More, more powah!"

    And through all of this: An old, pretty boy, arch, camp, international playboy Bond who was faster with a cheesy one liner than he was with his gun. A Bond whose knowledge consisted of the entire universe and everything in it. A Bond who wore his trousers so high they almost met his sagging nipples on the way down. A Bond who couldn't fight his way out of a paper bag. And a Bond who occasionally resembled his stuntmen.

    Those were the days.
  • TonyDPTonyDP Inside the MonolithPosts: 4,145MI6 Agent
    It seems that whenever a new Bond with a new direction appears, people have to question what came before and whether it was as good as they remember it.

    Moore's Bond was never rubbish. He did everything the producers ever asked of him and he did it with a becoming style and grace. He shepherded Bond thru the choppy waters of the 1970's and early 1980's. He starred in what is for my money one of the top three bond movies ever (TSWLM). He kept the series thriving and introduced a whole new generation of fans to Bond (I should know, I was part of that generation). He adapted the character of Bond to suit the changing times and no matter how outlandish the plot became he provided a steady anchor to every movie he appeared in. He probably overstayed his tenure by 2 or 3 films (in and of itself that is a sign of just how important the producers thought he was) but his contributions to Bond's ongoing success and vitality are beyond measure or reproach.
  • Klaus HergescheimerKlaus Hergescheimer Posts: 332MI6 Agent
    TonyDP wrote:
    It seems that whenever a new Bond with a new direction appears, people have to question what came before and whether it was as good as they remember it.

    Moore's Bond was never rubbish. He did everything the producers ever asked of him and he did it with a becoming style and grace. He shepherded Bond thru the choppy waters of the 1970's and early 1980's. He starred in what is for my money one of the top three bond movies ever (TSWLM). He kept the series thriving and introduced a whole new generation of fans to Bond (I should know, I was part of that generation). He adapted the character of Bond to suit the changing times and no matter how outlandish the plot became he provided a steady anchor to every movie he appeared in. He probably overstayed his tenure by 2 or 3 films (in and of itself that is a sign of just how important the producers thought he was) but his contributions to Bond's ongoing success and vitality are beyond measure or reproach.

    Couldn't have said it better myself. I wouldn't rank his films among my favorites, but they are definitely darned fun to watch, and Moore is certainly entertaining, even if he isn't my favorite. And Bond probably wouldn't have made it out of the 1970s without him.
  • vswongvswong Posts: 1MI6 Agent
    after watching CASINO ROYALE, felt that Roger Moore cannot be put in the same league as Daniel Craig for the roll of JAMES BOND.
    He was more of a comediene bond than a super spy
  • Dan SameDan Same Victoria, AustraliaPosts: 6,057MI6 Agent
    A Bond who couldn't fight his way out of a paper bag.
    MNL, I know you love Moore, but as a fan, you would have to appreciate that he could indeed fight. The scene with Sandor in TSWLM was an example of this. Yes, he wasn't as good a fighter as sevral of the other Bonds, but I still think he was convincing. Also, am I still the only person who doesn't think that Moore was camp? :o :D
    "He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
  • markdownmarkdown Posts: 47MI6 Agent
    edited November 2006
    Dan Same wrote:
    A Bond who couldn't fight his way out of a paper bag.
    MNL, I know you love Moore, but as a fan, you would have to appreciate that he could indeed fight. The scene with Sandor in TSWLM was an example of this. Yes, he wasn't as good a fighter as sevral of the other Bonds, but I still think he was convincing. Also, am I still the only person who doesn't think that Moore was camp? :o :D
    no i don't think he was camp either,just a point on his fight scenes he always seemed to come up against the largest henchmen who always had huge strength (jaws, kriegler gobinda etc)was this a an attempt to play up this image of not being as tough as connery or were they just trying to recreate the popularity of jaws.whatever the reason to my mind he always emerged from those scenes with a lot of credit.
  • Dan SameDan Same Victoria, AustraliaPosts: 6,057MI6 Agent
    markdown wrote:
    no i don't think he was camp either,just a point on his fight scenes he always seemed to come up against the largest henchmen who always had huge strength (jaws, kriegler gobinda etc)was this a an attempt to play up this image of not being as tough as connery or were they just trying to recreate the popularity of jaws.whatever the reason to my mind he always emerged from those scenes with a lot of credit.
    Thankyou markdown. :) It's good to know that I'm not alone. ;) (Although who would have thought that the first person to agree with me on these two points was a Dalton fan? :o :D)
    "He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
  • markdownmarkdown Posts: 47MI6 Agent
    Dan Same wrote:
    markdown wrote:
    no i don't think he was camp either,just a point on his fight scenes he always seemed to come up against the largest henchmen who always had huge strength (jaws, kriegler gobinda etc)was this a an attempt to play up this image of not being as tough as connery or were they just trying to recreate the popularity of jaws.whatever the reason to my mind he always emerged from those scenes with a lot of credit.
    Thankyou markdown. :) It's good to know that I'm not alone. ;) (Although who would have thought that the first person to agree with me on these two points was a Dalton fan? :o :D)
    your welcome dan :)yes i am indeed a dalton fan but i still appreciate the merits of the other actors who played the part. additionally i will always have a soft spot for moore having grown up with him as bond.
  • Moore Not LessMoore Not Less Posts: 1,095MI6 Agent
    edited November 2006
    Dan Same wrote:
    A Bond who couldn't fight his way out of a paper bag.
    MNL, I know you love Moore, but as a fan, you would have to appreciate that he could indeed fight. The scene with Sandor in TSWLM was an example of this. Yes, he wasn't as good a fighter as sevral of the other Bonds, but I still think he was convincing. Also, am I still the only person who doesn't think that Moore was camp? :o :D

    Dan, what ever gave you the idea that I love Roger Moore? :D

    Roger wasn't a bad fighter at all. The fight in Saida's dressing room (TMWTGG) with those three thugs is a good example. For the most part, Roger suffers in comparison to Sean Connery and George Lazenby. More so because he didn't benefit from Peter Hunt's editing style and direction in the same way that Sean and George did. I was interested by markdown's suggestion that this may have been a deliberate ploy to play to the image that Roger is not as tough as Sean. I hadn't really thought of that before.


    And Roger was not camp. :o :D
  • Dan SameDan Same Victoria, AustraliaPosts: 6,057MI6 Agent
    edited November 2006
    Dan, what ever gave you the idea that I love Roger Moore? :D
    Elementary my dear Watson. :D
    Roger wasn't a bad fighter at all. The fight in Saida's dressing room (TMWTGG) with those three thugs is a good example. For the most part, Roger suffers in comparison to Sean Connery and George Lazenby. More so because he didn't benefit from Peter Hunt's editing style and direction in the same way that Sean and George did. I was interested by Markdown's suggestion that this may have been a deliberate ploy to play to Roger's image and avoid any comparison with Connery. I hadn't really thought of that before.
    That's an interesting point. It's probably true. Nonetheless I thought Moore was pretty convincing. As you noted, the fight in TMWTGG was terrific.
    And Roger was not camp. :o :D
    Hear hear. {[] I mean, he wasn't as serious as Dalton, but that doesn't mean he was camp.
    "He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
  • Barry NelsonBarry Nelson ChicagoPosts: 1,505MI6 Agent
    I have always thought that Moore's Bond was right for its time, but then grew long in the tooth. I don't think a serious Bond would have played well in the 70's. He delivered some wonderful lines, with proper glib. I saw everyone of his films and enjoyed them all, although AVTAK was difficult to watch at times. They didn't keep inviting him back because he wasn't popular. A rubbish Bond? Certainly not.
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