51

Re: Subtext and themes

Barbel wrote:

It's just the law of averages, Higgins. You have to be right sooner or later! ajb007/lol

Well, he's certainly average  - but right ? Never  ajb007/lol

YNWA 96

The Unbearables

52

Re: Subtext and themes

Barbel wrote:

It's just the law of averages, Higgins. You have to be right sooner or later! ajb007/lol

ajb007/crap  yeah, I know. Even a broken watch shows the correct time twice in a day……  ajb007/biggrin

President of the 'Misty Eyes Club'.

-------Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!------

53

Re: Subtext and themes

Higgins wrote:
Barbel wrote:

It's just the law of averages, Higgins. You have to be right sooner or later! ajb007/lol

ajb007/crap  yeah, I know. Even a broken watch shows the correct time twice in a day……  ajb007/biggrin

Hey ! You may have managed it once - but TWICE ? Never !  ajb007/tongue

YNWA 96

The Unbearables

54

Re: Subtext and themes

A long article on the subtext in SF- http://politicalfilm.wordpress.com/2013 … t-skyfall/
I was intending to discuss this one in detail, since it's the most recent and does have more layers to it than usual, but this article deals with it quite comprehensively.

55

Re: Subtext and themes

An enlightening article about the subtext of Goldfinger, that has completely changed how I view this film now. I used to just think of it as not a serious Bond film, but with this new subtext being reveals to me, it has shone a whole new light on it.

http://commanderbond.net/1369/below-the … mplex.html.

56

Re: Subtext and themes

Good article, thanks for the link.

Richard Maibaum's thoughts on writing the screenplay for GF may be of interest. In his view, DN had been basically a mystery (Bond is sent to discover who killed Strangways & Trueblood, and why) while FRWL was a straight suspense story (the audience sees behind the scenes of the enemy's plot, and wants to see how Bond gets out of it). GF, however, he saw as a duel between two supermen, Bond and Goldfinger. They skirmish in small ways at first (cards, golf) then get more serious. This isn't a theme or subtext (see the above link posted by samurai4114 for those) but structure.

57

Re: Subtext and themes

Yes, very interesting. Another thing that is really contrasting between FRWL and GF is space. FRWL is very closed and gritty with lots of scenes with many people. You almost get claustrophobic from being in the train, and the closedness highlighted by the passerby when passing Bond and Kerim Bey. Or the scenes in Istanbul with all the other vehicles and people, or the Specter meeting on the boat...

While in Goldfinger, there are lots of shots with wide open landscapes, clear skies. Goldfinger and Bond are the only two golfers on a seemingly large course. The large plot of land for Gold fingers pilots. Fort Know is very large, and looks beautiful. The shots are much more scenic in Goldfinger then in From Russia With Love.

58

Re: Subtext and themes

Hadn't noticed that, but now that you mention it I'll be looking more closely. The two outdoor action scenes near the end of FRWL (helicopter chase, boat chase) were deliberately added in (they're not in the novel) to open the film out after the enclosed scenes you mention, and it's here that we get the most "open" shots.

59

Re: Subtext and themes

Another fasnicating article but this time about YOLT. The subtext here is insightful, and I think would even be better suited if the films went in the same order as the novels... ie YOLT after OHMSS

http://commanderbond.net/1009/below-the … twice.html

60

Re: Subtext and themes

Agreed, but John Cox didn't mention that the dying/rebirth theme of YOLT is all there in Fleming's novel, right down to the obituary, and indeed credits Roald Dahl as author. (Also his comment about "Ann in Tokyo"??!!! What??!!)

61

Re: Subtext and themes

He must of  thought Bond says Ann in Tokyo instead of M in Tokyo  ajb007/lol .

62

Re: Subtext and themes

Agreed, though that makes little sense in context.

I came across this piece on subtext in AVTAK- http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=ibFS … mp;f=false

Again, not a Bond film that a casual viewer would think possessed subtext and one that is often dismissed. The "age versus youth" theme of the film has been commented on before, by Raymond Benson for one- the good guys (Bond, Tibbett, M, Moneypenny, Q) are all late 50s to 70s (with the exception of Chuck Lee, whose role in the plot is miniscule) while the bad guys (Zorin, MayDay) are late 30s/early40s.
Personally, I don't think this is deliberate subtext. Walken and Jones were hired for their contemporary status/image, not their ages, while Moore & co were hired for continuity (OP had performed well enough that Moore's return was actively sought).
AVTAK has, as has been said many times, much in common with GF plot- and structure-wise*, but thematically the two films have little in common. Goldfinger's greed and lust for gold dominate the plot of the earlier film, while Zorin's are downplayed. Bond has a definite respect for Goldfinger ("I apologise, Goldfinger, it's an inspired scheme"), but merely distrust and later loathing for Zorin. There isn't a scene in the later film to compare with the laser-powered near-castration of Our Man, perhaps GF's finest moment, and one which carries its own significance as mentioned by John Cox above.


* Bond is sent to investigate gold/microchips shady dealing
Goldfinger/Zorin is an ostensibly respectable multi-millionaire businessman who plans to increase the value of his hoard of a valuable commodity by a huge criminal act
Goldfinger/Zorin holds a meeting with associates explaining his plan, with a tableau rising to explain. One wants to back out, and is killed by the main henchman/woman
Bond and the villain skirmish in social or sporting settings before getting down to the serious business (although this happens in other Bond stories too)
etc etc

63

Re: Subtext and themes

On Her Majesty's Secret Service

I've always felt that OHMSS has some interesting themes subtexts to it.

One is Identity.
Blofeld of course is trying to establish his title as a Count, which leads to his downfall. Bond uses Blofeld's weakness by assuming the identity of Sir Hilary Bray, countering with his own identity deceptions.
Blofeld: "It takes more than a few props to turn 007 into a herald."
Bond: "And it'll take more than cutting off your ear lobes to turn you into a count".
And Campbell poses as a mountain climber; and Draco and his men pose as Red Cross medics in the helicopter. No-one is who they seem to be. And in the film, doesn't a new Bond - George Lazenby- add to the question of identity?

Another of course is Time.
From the opening credits with the clock and hourglass, we know that time is an important theme.
Like many of the films, OHMSS shows Bond in a race against time to thwart the villain's plan - in this case, containing the virus before Blofeld's Angels of Death can release it.
But Time for Bond and Tracey adds another layer: "We have all the time in the world".
Tracey: "Anyway, you have given me a wedding present. The best I could have. A future".
Sadly, we know better.
And the film is dense with images of clocks, particularly the nail biting scenes in Gumbold's offices.

And isn't Virility a subtext in the film? Bond's virility is presented as invincible, from the string of beauties he beds ("Well, back to work. You've no idea how it's piling up") to Moneypenny's exclamation "Same old James!  Even more so!"). The vaccine is presented as Virulent too. And Blofeld played by Telly Savalas is larger than life with a swagger, wooing Tracey and mesmerising the Angels. Or maybe I'm just reading too much into it.  ajb007/crap

"How was your lamb?" "Skewered. One sympathises."

64

Re: Subtext and themes

That's a good point about Time as a theme in OHMSS. Some of that comes from Fleming, some from Maibaum and/or Hunt, and perhaps some from Maurice Binder. I don't know how much input Hunt had into the title sequence- did he tell Binder to use the clock and hourglass, or did Binder come up with that himself? Either way, it works perfectly.
Perhaps there's grounds for discussing the way in which the Bond main title sequences set up the plot, or reflect themes in the movie? Some do (eg SF, DAD) and some don't (eg TLD, FRWL).

65

Re: Subtext and themes

I remember in an interview M Binder said something along the lines of,
He didn't always put things into his title design as he didn't want to
Give too much away for the audience about locations etc.

“I remember the last thing my Nan said to me before she died.
‘What are you doing here with that hammer?’”..... Lee Mack.

66

Re: Subtext and themes

Imo the only elements with a purpose and planning in MBs titles where the naked ladies. Everything else was pure luck!  ajb007/biggrin

President of the 'Misty Eyes Club'.

-------Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!------

67

Re: Subtext and themes

ajb007/cheers  The man had his priorities right !  ajb007/lol

“I remember the last thing my Nan said to me before she died.
‘What are you doing here with that hammer?’”..... Lee Mack.

68

Re: Subtext and themes

I noticed last night watching DAF. In the funeral home as Bond sits
Waiting facing the alter. I noticed the stained glass , which of course
Given the name of the film is diamond shaped.
  Although this means the cross looks upside down, this as many know
Is used in black magic rituals so could it be used here as a sign that this
Is really a place of evil ?

“I remember the last thing my Nan said to me before she died.
‘What are you doing here with that hammer?’”..... Lee Mack.

69

Re: Subtext and themes

Thunderpussy wrote:

could it be used here as a sign that this
Is really a place of evil ?

Ask Baron Samedi. ajb007/lol

Dalton & Connery rule. Brozz was cool. Craig is too.
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.QOS 4.DN 5.GF/GE 6.SP 7.FRWL 8.TB/TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT

70

Re: Subtext and themes

Will I do?  ajb007/lol

The funeral home scene is there, as are other funeral/coffin bits in the Bond movies, as an in-joke to Cubby Broccoli's teenage job in an undertaker's. There are a surprising amount of them once you start looking! TP's well-spotted piece of set design seems coincidental IMHO- it would have been totally suited to LALD though.

71

Re: Subtext and themes

And the Coffin in MR  ajb007/martini

1.On Her Majesties Secret Service 2.The Living Daylights 3.license To Kill 4.The Spy Who Loved Me 5.Goldfinger

72

Re: Subtext and themes

It even carries over to QOS,  when Camile nips in front of a truck
Causing it to brake, sending many coffins across the road.  ajb007/martini

“I remember the last thing my Nan said to me before she died.
‘What are you doing here with that hammer?’”..... Lee Mack.

73

Re: Subtext and themes

Yup, that's one of them. The PTS of TB is another, DAF as above, LALD is full of them (naturally enough, and at least some of that is from the book), but there are more!

74

Re: Subtext and themes

Perhaps we could start a " where's Wally" thread only spotting
Bond Coffin references.  ajb007/lol

“I remember the last thing my Nan said to me before she died.
‘What are you doing here with that hammer?’”..... Lee Mack.

75

Re: Subtext and themes

Didn't Connery also have a spell polishing coffins or something similar after he'd left school?

"How was your lamb?" "Skewered. One sympathises."