LTK : nice rebound from TLD

alabamabondfan

Well, I was pleasantly surprised with LTK. It's the first Bond movie I've really enjoyed since TMWTGG. I thought Dalton was much better but he still pales in comparison to Connery and Moore. I think he's better in this than Lazenby was in OHMSS.

The plot was better in this, the actors were better. I really liked Carey Lowell. She is WAY up there on my Bond girl list. After she cuts her hair, she is smoking! I thought she was one of the sexiest Bond women ever.
Sanchez was a very good villian and Dario was a very good henchman.

I would think this film would have set up a bright future for the Bond franchise but since there wasn't a film made for 6 years and they switched to Pierce I'm going to assume this one bombed in the theater.

Now I move into the Brosnan era of Bond films. Looking forward to it!

Loeffelholz

For me, LTK was best when it stole from Fleming---particularly, the bit about Felix being mauled by the shark, which was culled from the LALD novel.

Very good moments in this one---more attuned to Dalton's strengths than TLD---but still a lack of focus, as far as I'm concerned. The wheelie-poppin' big rig is unforgivable, IMO But I enjoyed seeing Bond bloodied up at the end (very Fleming, that), and Carey Lowell is hot :x

I was really disappointed in the way Glen allowed Felix to be so chipper in his role of amputee and widower in his last scene... ?:)

Glad you enjoyed it, alabama {[]

alabamabondfan

well, my stupid dvr didn't record the end of the movie. I'll have to wait till Netflix can get it here so i can see the end. I didn't see the part with Felix that you mentioned. Bond was still chasing the last tanker and Sanchez when it cut off.

I totally agree with you about the wheelie poppin big rig.....I laughed at that part. I wouldn't have included it if it had been up to me.

I think when i get through watching all the movies, I'll start reading all Fleming's books.

Thanks for the response Loeffelholz.

blueman

Sorta the 80s in a nutshell: interesting moments surrounded by 100+ minutes of pap. That precredits is brutally, brutally bad. Lowell is hot, but looks/acts like a kick-ass CIA agent like Denise Richards looks/acts like a nuclear scientist. Nope, not buying it.

What I've never got behind is the basic premise: Bond knows who he wants to kill, and he's gone rogue. He's still a super agent/ninja-type assassin/ultimate spy--so why doesn't this movie last about 15 minutes? Sanchez is the target, just kill him. Bad TV-style writing, if you want me to believe it takes Bond 2+ hours and a wheelie-poppin' big rig to track down and kill this guy, there has to be some doubt or a mystery to figure out or something...we're talking Bond here, he has a Playboy Club card and everything, Sanchez should be toast before I'm halfway through my popcorn. Connery took out a drug ring in the freakin' precredits of GF with one big explosion. The whole thing's a pretty blatant MIAMI VICE ripoff, and that's darn sad.

Remember in CR, when M identifies Le Chiffre as the baddie, and Craig's response is something like, how fast do you want me to kill him? Now THAT's Bond, Fleming's Bond. LTK is a showcase for how NOT to make a Bond film IMHO. I'll credit the intention behind it, but it's a royal mess of a follow-through. Poor Dalton, even Lazenby got better...this never happened to the other guy(s) indeed.

Okay, rant over.

Dan Same

I am very disappointed with LTK. ALthough I love its concept (Bond goes rogue to seek revenge) I very much dislike the execution, which I blame on the script and Dalton's performance (the worst ever Bond performance IMO.) The major reason why I so dislike Dalton's performance was that it seemed to me that his emotions after Felix was attacked were no different to before Felix was attacked. I also agree with Blue that considering Bond's skills, the films seemed far too drawn-out. I think it would have been best if Bond didn't know who had atatcked Felix and his wife.

I also think that Carey Lowell, whilst not terrible, is pretty forgettable. In fact, the whole film, with the exception of Dalton's nightmare-inducing performance, is pretty forgettable. I don't hate LTK, but I'm pretty close to doing so.

alabamabondfan

blueman: I can definitely see where your coming from with the Miami Vice comparison. I still liked it better than TLD.

dansame: I really thought Dalton's performance was better in this one than in TLD. I can see a lot of the points you make though.

Napoleon Han Solo

I'm pretty happy with LTK. And Bond was going to shoot Sanchez but then he gets attacked, is taken into Sanchez' trust, destroys his operation then kills him. In all cases where he could have killed him earlier, his chances of being alive 30 seconds later would have been slim. I think someone writing was reading Punisher comics at the time, there definitely is a similar vibe. I don't have a big problem with the poppie wheelie, because that is minor for eighties movies. Leiter being so chipper at the end is odd, you wonder if that scene was filmed earlier and then they changed the script. Maybe originally his wife wasn't going to die. On the other hand, I think in action movies those days, revenge on someone who killed your loved ones was the recipe for total bliss. Or like in Lethal Weapon, kill some bad guys and you'll forget all about your dead wife. Not that that excuses the writing. I like LTK but I also like TLD. I didn't find his flirting with the girls awkward in TLD. I do remember the guy who plays Leiter in TLD being about the worst one though.

As with most Bond movies, I appreciate both Daltons as being products of their time and subject to the excesses and tastes thereof. I daresay we will one day look back and say the same about CR.

darenhat

blueman wrote:

What I've never got behind is the basic premise: Bond knows who he wants to kill, and he's gone rogue. He's still a super agent/ninja-type assassin/ultimate spy--so why doesn't this movie last about 15 minutes? Sanchez is the target, just kill him.

As I recall, that's exactly what Bond tried to do. But first he had to find out who helped Sanchez (Killifer and Krest). By the time he arrives in Isthmus, the first thing he does is track down Sanchez and try to put a bullet in his head. Unfortunately, he's interrupted by the Ninjas. Once Bond realized that he was starting to interfere in other operations (Hong Kong narcotics, and the CIA's Stinger deal with Heller) Bond realizes that he needs to tread a bit more lightly in taking out Sanchez.

The execution of the film wasn't great, but I really feel the essence of the story is one of the stronger Bond outings.

RJJB

And if you remember, Bond did not just kill Sanchez, he also manipulated Sanchez to destroy his own organization. He got Sanchez to be paranoid and distrustfil about his own people so he that did Bond's dirty work. Sanchez himself killed Krest, Heller and Truman Lodge. Guess he lent Sanchez his license to kill.

Loeffelholz

RJJB wrote:

And if you remember, Bond did not just kill Sanchez, he also manipulated Sanchez to destroy his own organization. He got Sanchez to be paranoid and distrustfil about his own people so he that did Bond's dirty work. Sanchez himself killed Krest, Heller and Truman Lodge. Guess he lent Sanchez his license to kill.

It should be noted that Akira Kurosawa did this first, in his brilliant 1961 film, Yojimbo...and Sergio Leone did it second, in his also-classic 1964 spaghetti western, A Fistful of Dollars...

Still, if you're going to steal, be sure to steal from the best

blueman

Never thought of LTK in that way, not at all. Eastwood's character had no perosnal revenge motive, he was just trying to get rich. Just don't buy the premise of LTK the way they worked it, it's TV-lame, not appropriate for a Bond film at all.

Loeffelholz

Kurosawa's character, Sanjuro (as played by the great Toshiro Mifune), did not have a revenge motive going into the piece, either...Eon brought the element of revenge to the mix, using LALD's mistreatment of Leiter as a springboard.

After that, though, it's pretty much by the numbers: Yojimbo, A Fistful of Dollars and Licence to Kill are all about a provocateur infiltrating rival factions, sowing seeds of mistrust and making them kill each other. Mind you, I'm not asserting that the last is in the same class as the first two...

That Michael Wilson is some screenwriter.

Dan Same

Loeffelholz wrote:

Kurosawa's character, Sanjuro (as played by the great Toshiro Mifune), did not have a revenge motive going into the piece, either...Eon brought the element of revenge to the mix, using LALD's mistreatment of Leiter as a springboard.

After that, though, it's pretty much by the numbers: Yojimbo, A Fistful of Dollars and Licence to Kill are all about a provocateur infiltrating rival factions, sowing seeds of mistrust and making them kill each other. Mind you, I'm not asserting that the last is in the same class as the first two...

That Michael Wilson is some screenwriter.

) I'm sorry, but putting LTK in the same paragraph as masterpieces like Yojimbo and Licence to Kill is hysterical. You're right of course that the idea of playing gangsters off one another comes from the above mentioned films. I guess it shows that the producers were really trying to make a special Bond film. Shame about the execution.

Alex

I'm not a fan of the first act. (plane tow, wedding, godawful theme song).

But it's all aces after Bond goes rogue. And I can see the Fistful Of Dollars vibe going on in a few occasions.

blueman

I guess I see every reason for Bond to simply kill Sanchez, and all of his associates and henchmen, bar none. The whole screw-with-them-and-play-them-off-each-other thing just isn't Bond IMO, not as presented anyway. Oh well, different strokes and all.