Goldeneye PTS

SeanIsTheOnlyOneSeanIsTheOnlyOne Posts: 117MI6 Agent
edited February 24 in The James Bond Films
Hi everyone,

There are a few things I was wondering about Goldeneye PTS. I rewatched the movie recently and I just can't help thinking there are some holes...

First of all, does Ourumov shoot Trevelyan with blanks to fake his death ? If it's the case, when Bond escapes from the facility, I guess Alec has time to get up and to take shelter before the mines explode. I mean, it's the kind of detail a mastermind must take into account. After all, he knew everything about the mission except the fact Bond would change the countdown but I suppose he was aware anyway he would have few time to protect himself. So what did he do exactly during this three minutes and did he really need three more to make his "plot" succeed ? Alec only had to make Bond believe he had just been killed by Ourumov, nothing more.

The second thing I don't understand is why Ourumov does not try to disarm the mines instead of chasing Bond. The location is about to blow up and he seems more interested with stopping the trespasser, which is quite a weird sense of priorities in such a situation ! Given Alec was an accomplice from the beginning, he could have told the Soviet colonel how to protect the location.

Comments

  • caractacus pottscaractacus potts Orbital communicator, level 10Posts: 2,186MI6 Agent
    there are a few issues with Alec's faked death at the beginning of Goldeneye, some of which got debated in the Little Niggles thread starting at post 885.
    I think you've thought up a few more! it all doesn't really make sense.

    my own theory is he used a plastic surgery double, since so much of his evil scheme is based on Diamonds are Forever already. (note how the much maligned DaF does a better job of explaining things!)
  • Golrush007Golrush007 South AfricaPosts: 2,909Quartermasters
    Here's a passage from Andy Lane and Paul Simpson's The Bond Files, which goes into some detail around the puzzling aspects of the Goldeneye PTS:

    "When we see the chemical weapons facility in long shot at the end of the pre-title sequence, it's on top of a mountain range. However, earlier on, Bond has to bungee jump from the top to the bottom of the dam to get into it. Aren't dams usually at the bottom of mountain ranges, not at the top?

    Trevelyan and Ourumov have presumably set up the sequence in which Ourumov apparently kills Trevelyan in order to fool Bond into thinking he is dead. Why did they do that if their intention was to kill Bond anyway? Why didn't Trevelyan kill Bond when he had a gun pointed at him earlier? Also, was it really necessary to gun down so many Russian soldiers to convince Bond? How does Ourumov feel about this? Or was the whole Janus charade discussed and arranged between Trevelyan and Ourumov in those few seconds while Ourumov had a gun at Trevelyan's head? Whatever way you look at it, it doesn't make any sense?"

    None of these 'problems' make the sequence any less enjoyable to me, but it is quite fun to look at them in this way and pull them apart. I've also always wondered about Ourumov's pistol...was it loaded with a blank for when he 'shot' Trevelyan, and then the next round was live for when he executed his own trigger-happy soldier? Or was that kill also an act?
  • emtiememtiem SurreyPosts: 4,055MI6 Agent
    Thing is, you can't fire a blank at someone's head at point blank range without killing them. Maybe he aimed his gun to the side and hoped Bond wouldn't notice, but you'd still probably deafen Alec! :)

    I guess the only way it sort of makes sense is that Ouromov is already a traitor at this point: they have premeditated it (let's say in the movie world blanks don't kill people!) but Alec can't kill Bond on sight and then go to Ouromov because he'd be captured by the real Russians. So the show of killing him is as much for all of the soldiers there as it is for Bond; they want to show that the foreign spies have been killed so that Alec can slip off into the shadows when everyone's back is turned.
    Even then I think there are quite a few holes in it! :D
    The second thing I don't understand is why Orumov does not try to disarm the mines instead of chasing Bond. The location is about to blow up and he seems more interested with stopping the trespasser, which is quite a weird sense of priorities in such a situation ! Given Alec was an accomplice from the beginning, he could have told the Soviet colonel how to protect the location.

    That is a good point. Indeed why doesn't Alec do it? Maybe there are still some soldiers around and he has to play dead.
  • caractacus pottscaractacus potts Orbital communicator, level 10Posts: 2,186MI6 Agent
    Golrush007 wrote:
    "When we see the chemical weapons facility in long shot at the end of the pre-title sequence, it's on top of a mountain range. However, earlier on, Bond has to bungee jump from the top to the bottom of the dam to get into it. Aren't dams usually at the bottom of mountain ranges, not at the top?
    now this part I don't have an issue with.

    Dams used to generate hydroelectric power are placed where there would be a steep elevational drop, to maximise the water pressure. Thus the top of a steep valley would be a good place, there might naturally have been a waterfall there otherwise.
    This does not mean at the top of the mountain range, there would only be glacier fed gulleys near those peaks, but the streams from those peaks gather in a valley, and presumably in this case there is a sudden steep drop in that valley...

    ...which is where we see Bond use his previously unseen superpower of flight to enter the open door of an out-of-control aircraft.
  • Number24Number24 NorwayPosts: 17,546MI6 Agent
    The dam has to be high up, but the generator and the rest of the hydropower plant has to be at the bottom. The point is to have the maximum speed and pressure when the water hits the generator.

    I think it's dangerous to have a blank fired at your head at point... blank range, but it's not necceserily lethal and often it only give minor damage. I remember an officer fired one point blank at a hard card board sheet with a AG3 (licence buildt HK G3) and the card board got a few small holes, it looked like someone had puntured it with needles. Sometimes blanks produced a muzzle flash, but usually blanks had pretty much no effect. Pistols obviously have much shorter barrels, but the blanks have far less gunpowder.
  • SeanIsTheOnlyOneSeanIsTheOnlyOne Posts: 117MI6 Agent
    edited February 24
    emtiem wrote:
    Alec can't kill Bond on sight and then go to Ouromov because he'd be captured by the real Russians.


    I don't think Alec ever thought he could be captured by the Russians, even considering his origins. Furthermore, if it had happened, he could have negociated with them thanks to his knowledge of many secret files from MI6.

    About killing Bond, remember what Alec says when they meet again: "I did think of asking you to join my little scheme".
    Alec really had affection for Bond despite his hate for England. That's why he didn't kill him. I even wonder if having both Bond and Alec dead wouldn't have led MI6 to check whether one of them could have been a mole, whereas having 006 being killed and 007 escaping from the facility seems much less suspicious.


    emtiem wrote:
    I guess the only way it sort of makes sense is that Ouromov is already a traitor at this point: they have premeditated it


    Of course they have. Otherwise, how'd you explain Alec survived while Ourumov pointed a gun at him ? They've been partners in crime from the beginning until the Cossak betrayed the Russian general.
    But I still don't understand what Alec had forecasted after Ourumov faked killing him. His main goal was to make Bond believe in his death. But while Bond was outside fighting with the battalion and trying to escape, Alec could have taken shelter somewhere to avoid having his face damaged...

    That's why this "three minutes" concept is not very clear.
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