Pros and cons: No Time To Die SPOILERS

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  • Number24Number24 NorwayPosts: 19,982MI6 Agent

    Many good points, Barbel. But I think you know the ending was very deliberate and not something they tried to avoid.

  • ichaiceichaice LondonPosts: 512MI6 Agent

    Madeleine: I'm not the first to mention that there's no chemistry between Craig and Seydoux, which is more than unfortunate considering how much of the plot depends on it.


    I was thinking this myself recently. There was nothing in Spectre that warranted the return of this love story. Apart from the Jamaica scenes and the first part of the Cuba scenes I’m starting to wish DC had not come back.

    Yes. Considerably!
    Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lukey_sparrow/
  • BarbelBarbel ScotlandPosts: 33,441Chief of Staff

    Personally I wish he'd never been there in the first place, but that is very unimportant.

    As to his coming back, the picture (no pun intended) is muddied by the pandemic which affected both the financial reception of NTTD and owing to the longer than intended delay and consequent anticipation the emotional reaction to it. We'll never know if feelings would be different if the film had been released a reasonable time after its predecessor.

  • BarbelBarbel ScotlandPosts: 33,441Chief of Staff

    PS my definition of "a reasonable time" differs from that of Eon.

  • emtiememtiem SurreyPosts: 4,766MI6 Agent
    edited June 17

    Nomi: Introduced well, then has nowhere to go. A new, younger 007 has definite dramatic possibilities but this film makes nothing of them. Her handing the title of "007" back to Bond makes no sense in context.

    One of my major bugbears with the film too: if you removed her it would make absolutely no difference to the film. Bond beats her in every one of their skirmishes (she even fails on their very first meeting- she's supposed to warn him off but she actually convinces him to get involved!) so there's no real feeling of two rivals competing: he simply outclasses her easily, which is rather dull. He learns nothing from her, all she really learns is that Bond is great, but we already knew that. Even Amasova in TSWLM gets the upper hand on Bond a couple of times: you need that if they're supposed to be sparring.

    She could have been interesting, she should have been interesting. You could have drawn parallels between her and Bond himself in CR (they're both starting out as 007 even: it's on a plate), she could have saved his life, Bond could have been shown that perhaps sometimes playing by the book works and she could have learned that a little bit of roguishness is needed sometimes too; but ultimately the film just isn't really interested in her. Take her out and you have the same story, which is a really bad sign.

    I totally agree with all of your pros too! 😊

  • ichaiceichaice LondonPosts: 512MI6 Agent

    I hear you but then there wouldn’t have been the Casino Royale we got which is my favourite (not just Bond ) film of all time.

    Yes. Considerably!
    Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lukey_sparrow/
  • BarbelBarbel ScotlandPosts: 33,441Chief of Staff

    I love that film too, but mainly because of the Fleming content.

  • Glidrose007Glidrose007 Posts: 62MI6 Agent

    Pros -

    1. Quite liked some of the action sequences. The PTS was very good, as was the ending with Craig walking through Safin's lair with the gun. These moments felt very much like the books for me.
    2. Bond in Jamaica. Nice seeing him take a shower. Liked the sequence in the nightclub with Felix.
    3. Cuba - I quite liked Paloma, but I'm not overly blown like everyone else is by her. I think she stands out because most of the the film is so bleak in comparison.
    4. I like the usage of the YOLT novel with Safin's lair.


    Cons -

    1. Could have done without the Norway flashbacks, could have done without Madeline and the daughter too.
    2. Safin was so unnecessary. Blofeld as the main villain would have worked so much better,
    3. Hated the Bond v Blofeld scene. Craig's acting here is truly abysmal. Probably the single worst performance in the entire franchise.
    4. Hated the ending. You don't kill off the main character - ever! They should have used the Sparrows Tears final chapter of YOLT, and left it open.
    5. Why kill Felix off? Again, another pointless moment, just to add another shock element. Keeps the young Netflixers happy I guess.
    6. Paloma action sequence. Suddenly felt we were in bad Moore/Brozza territory again. Many people loved the sequence, but I can only guess is because it is light relief from everything else before and after it.
    7. Awful, awful song. Babs reign as producer has given us without doubt the worst songs of the franchise - DAD, QoS, SP and now NTTD.
    8. Hated the use of OHMSS music in the film. I liked it when I first heard it appear, but by the end credits it just felt tacky and wrong.
    9. Way too long as a movie.


    CR had so much promise when it was first released. I was so optimistic for the future of the franchise, but it sadly went all downhill from there. Craig was given too much control, but he didn't use it in a good way like Dalton would have done. I got the impression he was never a fan of the Fleming books. He wanted to carve out the character in his own vision, and by NTTD he had absolutely destroyed it. Feeling sorry and pity for Bond before his final death scene is not something I would ever be seeking in a Bond movie, and I doubt many other fans would be either - yet this is what the brains behind this operation thought we all wanted to see.

    Very disappointing film overall, and a sad way to bring the curtain down on Craig's Bond era. NTTD is down there with the dregs of the franchise (usual suspects - DAD, AVTAK, TWINE, SP).

  • chrisno1chrisno1 LondonPosts: 2,062MI6 Agent

    @Glidrose007 I can't believe I never saw you post this. Very astute and brief summary of Ps and Cs.

    I think you are right about the Cuba scenes. I too am in the 'love' Paloma corner, but having watched the movie 3 times - which felt more than enough - I get exactly what you are saying and yet that is exactly why I enjoy the character and the sequence, because it does hark back to a more laid back, tongue firmly in the cheek era of OO7. I mean all that business with the robot eye and the killing spray - it's utter drivelling nonsense, probably one of the most absurd moments the franchise has ever provided. You just can't take it seriously. Which begs the question: why is the remainder of the film so glum and heavy going? It is almost as if a different writer chipped in with this scene. Oh, right, I think she did... Anyway, fun isn't a crime in my book and Craig-Bond or perhaps Craig himself really ought not to take the franchise so seriously. His five films are too earnest by a chalk. "C'mon, lighten, dude," I kept thinking.

    At distance [I haven't seen NTTD since March] I agree with most of your cons and entirely agree too with your take on the ending as I am a huge fan of the novel YOLT, whose ending rightly anticipates what might come next. That would have worked far better than killing off James Bond altogether on a fanciful actor's whim.

  • MI6_HeadquartersMI6_Headquarters Posts: 37MI6 Agent

    Great insight! @Glidrose007 , really agreed with each of your points.

    It really got my same feelings towards the film

    Ranking of Ian Fleming Novels/Books

    1. Moonraker 2. Casino Royale 3. From Russia With Love 4. Thunderball 5. You Only Live Twice 6. Dr. No 7. Diamonds Are Forever 8. Goldfinger 9. Live And Let Die 10. On Her Majesty's Secret Service 11. The Spy Who Loved Me 12. The Man With The Golden Gun

    Ranking the Short Stories:

    1. The Living Daylights 2. From A View To A Kill 3. For Your Eyes Only 4. The Hildebrand Rarity 5. Risico 6. Quantum Of Solace 7. Octopussy

  • Glidrose007Glidrose007 Posts: 62MI6 Agent
  • BarbelBarbel ScotlandPosts: 33,441Chief of Staff

    Belated agreement from me, too.

  • The Red KindThe Red Kind EnglandPosts: 2,630MI6 Agent

    Ditto from me. Truly loved many aspects of NTTD but the negatives are like flies on the pizza.

    "Any of the opposition around..?"
  • Number24Number24 NorwayPosts: 19,982MI6 Agent

    Are really the robot eye and the killing spray among the most absurd moments in the series? I doubt it.

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