Pros and Cons: Goldeneye

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Comments

  • Dirty PunkerDirty Punker ...Your Eyes Only, darling."Posts: 2,586MI6 Agent
    Even the eye brow raise at pulling rank is pulled off masterfully.
    He is Bond.
    a reasonable rate of return
  • RemingtonRemington CAPosts: 239MI6 Agent
    I've noticed the colors of the film are very different between the 1999 DVD and the more recent ones. The whole "looks like TV movie cinematography" I think is due to the different look on those later releases. Was the old DVD closer to how it originally looked?
    -{
    1. Connery 2. Moore 3. Dalton 4. Brosnan 5. Craig 6. Lazenby
  • ToTheRightToTheRight Posts: 314MI6 Agent
    Remington wrote:
    I've noticed the colors of the film are very different between the 1999 DVD and the more recent ones. The whole "looks like TV movie cinematography" I think is due to the different look on those later releases. Was the old DVD closer to how it originally looked?
    -{

    The deeper contrast on the newer version is fairly accurate, but the overall color hues on the earlier release is closer to what the film looked like in cinemas. I saw it about 12 times. I was pretty obsessed with the colors on the Bonds and whenever I'd catch one in the cinema I'd be calibrating my television afterwards to try and get it as close as possible.

    One big difference between the cinematic prints and pretty much every home video release I've seen is the gunbarrel.
    In the cinema the blood was very very dark, almost maroon. The later Brosnan movies brightened the blood a bit and that's what the VHS, DVD and Blu-rays capture.
  • RemingtonRemington CAPosts: 239MI6 Agent
    ToTheRight wrote:
    Remington wrote:
    I've noticed the colors of the film are very different between the 1999 DVD and the more recent ones. The whole "looks like TV movie cinematography" I think is due to the different look on those later releases. Was the old DVD closer to how it originally looked?
    -{

    The deeper contrast on the newer version is fairly accurate, but the overall color hues on the earlier release is closer to what the film looked like in cinemas. I saw it about 12 times. I was pretty obsessed with the colors on the Bonds and whenever I'd catch one in the cinema I'd be calibrating my television afterwards to try and get it as close as possible.

    One big difference between the cinematic prints and pretty much every home video release I've seen is the gunbarrel.
    In the cinema the blood was very very dark, almost maroon. The later Brosnan movies brightened the blood a bit and that's what the VHS, DVD and Blu-rays capture.
    Interesting. Thank you.
    -{
    1. Connery 2. Moore 3. Dalton 4. Brosnan 5. Craig 6. Lazenby
  • Dirty PunkerDirty Punker ...Your Eyes Only, darling."Posts: 2,586MI6 Agent
    Remington wrote:
    ToTheRight wrote:
    Remington wrote:
    I've noticed the colors of the film are very different between the 1999 DVD and the more recent ones. The whole "looks like TV movie cinematography" I think is due to the different look on those later releases. Was the old DVD closer to how it originally looked?
    -{

    The deeper contrast on the newer version is fairly accurate, but the overall color hues on the earlier release is closer to what the film looked like in cinemas. I saw it about 12 times. I was pretty obsessed with the colors on the Bonds and whenever I'd catch one in the cinema I'd be calibrating my television afterwards to try and get it as close as possible.

    One big difference between the cinematic prints and pretty much every home video release I've seen is the gunbarrel.
    In the cinema the blood was very very dark, almost maroon. The later Brosnan movies brightened the blood a bit and that's what the VHS, DVD and Blu-rays capture.
    Interesting. Thank you.
    -{
    Remington, I found this link that may be of use.
    http://goldeneyedossier.blogspot.gr/2016/05/goldeneye-from-big-screen-to-small.html
    a reasonable rate of return
  • RemingtonRemington CAPosts: 239MI6 Agent
    Remington wrote:
    ToTheRight wrote:

    The deeper contrast on the newer version is fairly accurate, but the overall color hues on the earlier release is closer to what the film looked like in cinemas. I saw it about 12 times. I was pretty obsessed with the colors on the Bonds and whenever I'd catch one in the cinema I'd be calibrating my television afterwards to try and get it as close as possible.

    One big difference between the cinematic prints and pretty much every home video release I've seen is the gunbarrel.
    In the cinema the blood was very very dark, almost maroon. The later Brosnan movies brightened the blood a bit and that's what the VHS, DVD and Blu-rays capture.
    Interesting. Thank you.
    -{
    Remington, I found this link that may be of use.
    http://goldeneyedossier.blogspot.gr/2016/05/goldeneye-from-big-screen-to-small.html
    Fascination info. Much appreciated brother.
    -{
    1. Connery 2. Moore 3. Dalton 4. Brosnan 5. Craig 6. Lazenby
  • zaphod99zaphod99 Posts: 1,405MI6 Agent
    Even the eye brow raise at pulling rank is pulled off masterfully.
    He is Bond.

    That is such a terrific micro moment. Very classy.
    Of that of which we cannot speak we must pass over in silence- Ludwig Wittgenstein.
  • ToTheRightToTheRight Posts: 314MI6 Agent
    Remington wrote:
    ToTheRight wrote:

    The deeper contrast on the newer version is fairly accurate, but the overall color hues on the earlier release is closer to what the film looked like in cinemas. I saw it about 12 times. I was pretty obsessed with the colors on the Bonds and whenever I'd catch one in the cinema I'd be calibrating my television afterwards to try and get it as close as possible.

    One big difference between the cinematic prints and pretty much every home video release I've seen is the gunbarrel.
    In the cinema the blood was very very dark, almost maroon. The later Brosnan movies brightened the blood a bit and that's what the VHS, DVD and Blu-rays capture.
    Interesting. Thank you.
    -{
    Remington, I found this link that may be of use.
    http://goldeneyedossier.blogspot.gr/2016/05/goldeneye-from-big-screen-to-small.html

    That is a great link. Wish there were one for each film. Always fun to compare the differences in the various video releases.
  • heartbroken_mr_draxheartbroken_mr_drax New Zealand Posts: 2,029MI6 Agent
    ^ very interesting indeed. The colouring/restoration process has always been an interesting topic - and something that fans take notice of. The whole tidy-up of Hitchcock's Vertigo is one that's interesting about how much artistic licence should be allowed.

    I watched the PTS of Goldeneye over the weekend and noticed quite a few interesting shots that are very unique to GE - in particular the close up framing of Brosnan's reaction shots - such as the blue sky background when he picks up the bike - total hero shots.

    I get the "TV movie" sentiment. All the outside shots look great and much of the cinematography is perfectly fine - it's just that some of the inside sets can let the film down:

    https://screenmusings.org/movie/blu-ray/Goldeneye/images/Goldeneye-0560.jpg

    The sets lack a bit of polish, and a bit of atmosphere. It exists in TND as well and it's something that gets tidied up in TWINE...
    1. TWINE 2. FYEO 3. MR 4. TLD 5. TSWLM 6. OHMSS 7. DN 8. OP 9. AVTAK 10. TMWTGG 11. QoS 12. GE 13. CR 14. TB 15. FRWL 16. LTK 17. GF 18. SF 19. LaLD 20. YOLT 21. TND 22. DAD 23. DAF.

    "If you'll forgive me, that's a little too scented for my palate."
  • Dirty PunkerDirty Punker ...Your Eyes Only, darling."Posts: 2,586MI6 Agent
    ^ very interesting indeed. The colouring/restoration process has always been an interesting topic - and something that fans take notice of. The whole tidy-up of Hitchcock's Vertigo is one that's interesting about how much artistic licence should be allowed.

    I watched the PTS of Goldeneye over the weekend and noticed quite a few interesting shots that are very unique to GE - in particular the close up framing of Brosnan's reaction shots - such as the blue sky background when he picks up the bike - total hero shots.

    The sets lack a bit of polish, and a bit of atmosphere. It exists in TND as well and it's something that gets tidied up in TWINE...
    Yes, the GoldenEye Dossier is a great resource, wish it was done for more films.

    Campbell also has a hankering for crotch shots in GoldenEye; the butcher walking away and Natalya walking up to Brosnan on the beach. Not to mention that he also uses beach scenes for the emotional stuff (the aforementioned scene and the scene with Vesper in Casino Royale). Another thing that I admire on GE (off the top of my head) are the tracking, single shot scenes, the Moneypenny scene and the deleted one where Bond and Vesper are walking up to the car in Casino Royale.
    Honestly, if I ever get bored enough, I might make such directorial connections throughout the span of the movie for GoldenEye and Casino Royale.

    I think they make up for it in lighting and cinematography which add to the effect. Coordinated lighting is something I hadn't seen before in a Bond (the Fort Knox miniature scene in GF being the only other contender, can't think of any others).
    Screen_Shot_2018_02_19_at_14_43_23.png
    Screen_Shot_2018_02_19_at_14_43_55.png
    Screen_Shot_2018_02_19_at_14_47_18.png
    The scene I was thinking of, below.
    Screen_Shot_2018_02_19_at_14_49_30.png
    a reasonable rate of return
  • walther p99walther p99 NJPosts: 3,394MI6 Agent
    Screen_Shot_2018_02_19_at_14_43_55.png
    Absolutely love that shot of Brosnan.
  • Dirty PunkerDirty Punker ...Your Eyes Only, darling."Posts: 2,586MI6 Agent
    Screen_Shot_2018_02_19_at_14_43_55.png
    Absolutely love that shot of Brosnan.
    Not just that, the whole build up to it is brilliant.
    a reasonable rate of return
  • heartbroken_mr_draxheartbroken_mr_drax New Zealand Posts: 2,029MI6 Agent
    I think they make up for it in lighting and cinematography which add to the effect. Coordinated lighting is something I hadn't seen before in a Bond (the Fort Knox miniature scene in GF being the only other contender, can't think of any others).

    100% agree with that.
    1. TWINE 2. FYEO 3. MR 4. TLD 5. TSWLM 6. OHMSS 7. DN 8. OP 9. AVTAK 10. TMWTGG 11. QoS 12. GE 13. CR 14. TB 15. FRWL 16. LTK 17. GF 18. SF 19. LaLD 20. YOLT 21. TND 22. DAD 23. DAF.

    "If you'll forgive me, that's a little too scented for my palate."
  • RemingtonRemington CAPosts: 239MI6 Agent
    Definitely a fantastic introduction to a fantastic Bond.
    -{
    1. Connery 2. Moore 3. Dalton 4. Brosnan 5. Craig 6. Lazenby
  • Agent PurpleAgent Purple Posts: 857MI6 Agent
    I've an issue with my GE Blu-ray: it skips a bit around the time Natalya's kidnapped. I dunno if that can be fixed.

    If I recall well, it did that in my last 2 viewings (I think I commented on both here). Most of the film flows fine, as I recall, it just has that minor issue.

    A shame, since this is one of those films that has major replay value for me.

    My other Bond Blu-rays have worked fine, btw.
    "Hostile takeovers. Shall we?"
    New 2020 ranking (for now DAF and FYEO keep their previous placements)
    1. TLD 2. TND 3. GF 4. TSWLM 5. TWINE 6. OHMSS 7. LtK 8. TMWTGG 9. L&LD 10. YOLT 11. DAD 12. QoS 13. DN 14. GE 15. SF 16. OP 17. MR 18. AVTAK 19. TB 20. FRWL 21. CR 22. FYEO 23. DAF (SP to be included later)
    Bond actors to be re-ranked later
  • Dirty PunkerDirty Punker ...Your Eyes Only, darling."Posts: 2,586MI6 Agent
    By skipping you mean it freezes and goes to another part of the film?
    If the blu ray player is at fault, clean the laser innit. If it's the disc... buy another one.
    a reasonable rate of return
  • Agent PurpleAgent Purple Posts: 857MI6 Agent
    I'm pretty sure it's the disc.

    I'll have to deal with that soon, as Bond 25 comes soon so I need GE for my Bondathons prior.
    "Hostile takeovers. Shall we?"
    New 2020 ranking (for now DAF and FYEO keep their previous placements)
    1. TLD 2. TND 3. GF 4. TSWLM 5. TWINE 6. OHMSS 7. LtK 8. TMWTGG 9. L&LD 10. YOLT 11. DAD 12. QoS 13. DN 14. GE 15. SF 16. OP 17. MR 18. AVTAK 19. TB 20. FRWL 21. CR 22. FYEO 23. DAF (SP to be included later)
    Bond actors to be re-ranked later
  • Agent PurpleAgent Purple Posts: 857MI6 Agent
    Bought GoldenEye once more (previously I'd purchased the Bond 50 collection). We're flowing into summer, a fine period to Bond out.
    "Hostile takeovers. Shall we?"
    New 2020 ranking (for now DAF and FYEO keep their previous placements)
    1. TLD 2. TND 3. GF 4. TSWLM 5. TWINE 6. OHMSS 7. LtK 8. TMWTGG 9. L&LD 10. YOLT 11. DAD 12. QoS 13. DN 14. GE 15. SF 16. OP 17. MR 18. AVTAK 19. TB 20. FRWL 21. CR 22. FYEO 23. DAF (SP to be included later)
    Bond actors to be re-ranked later
  • Jimmy BondJimmy Bond Posts: 319MI6 Agent
    I largely enjoy the film, but my main gripe with it would be with Travelyan's intention for Bond. Specfically... I've no idea what he intends for him. What does he want to do with Bond? Does he intend to kill him or for him to survive so he can enjoy his success? I was thoroughly confused by that, throughout. That, and the unimpressive score really bring it down.
  • Nicolas SuszczykNicolas Suszczyk Buenos Aires, ArgentinaPosts: 23MI6 Agent
    Pros: ALL.
    Cons: NONE.

    :))

    Thank you for the kind words about The GoldenEye Dossier above, which will get an important update on January 1, 2020. Meanwhile, you might like to check this one out... bit.do/goldeneyeworld -{ :D
    Nicolás Suszczyk
    Author, THE WORLD OF GOLDENEYE (bit.do/goldeneyeworld)
    Visit my site THE GOLDENEYE DOSSIER (goldeneyedossier.blogspot.com)
  • GrindelwaldGrindelwald Posts: 1,267MI6 Agent
    Lousy soundtrack imo , only decent music is Bond vs Sean Bean
  • eric7064eric7064 USAPosts: 343MI6 Agent
    People hate the soundtrack. But its iconic to me. Maybe because I grew up with it. There us just something about it thsy just brings back the memories.
  • Agent PurpleAgent Purple Posts: 857MI6 Agent
    edited February 2020
    Alright, so I'm back in Bondness.

    Re-watched this film and an 8/10 this time around.

    Sean Bean's performance was my biggest issue, just lacks punch for me.

    I may have been too hard on Campbell in the past, accusing him of having a soulless style or something like that. This is a damn good movie as far as I'm concerned, just not one I'm as crazy about as I used to be.

    I also give Pierce a B+ for his performance here. Not quite great, but quite good.

    I think my issue with GE (in summary) is that it lacks in terms of high notes, there's not enough in it that has a wow factor for me, but I think it's a damn good film.
    "Hostile takeovers. Shall we?"
    New 2020 ranking (for now DAF and FYEO keep their previous placements)
    1. TLD 2. TND 3. GF 4. TSWLM 5. TWINE 6. OHMSS 7. LtK 8. TMWTGG 9. L&LD 10. YOLT 11. DAD 12. QoS 13. DN 14. GE 15. SF 16. OP 17. MR 18. AVTAK 19. TB 20. FRWL 21. CR 22. FYEO 23. DAF (SP to be included later)
    Bond actors to be re-ranked later
  • Unknown007Unknown007 Posts: 142MI6 Agent
    Love this movie, Brosnan opens his account in a really positive, strong manner and he continued to get stronger in his following Bond Movies - 007 out of 10 for effort.

    One small minor con in all this was the disappointing use of the BMW Z3 Roadster - When you see it in Q Branch you think, great we’re going to have a strong car chase scene, oh dear, then nothing before it appears only to be whipped off by Jack Wade (or was that Brad Whittaker’s twin?) in exchange for a Cessna.
  • Agent PurpleAgent Purple Posts: 857MI6 Agent
    The score didn't bother me per se on my last viewing, but I'd say it's not one of the stronger ones. It does the job I suppose.
    "Hostile takeovers. Shall we?"
    New 2020 ranking (for now DAF and FYEO keep their previous placements)
    1. TLD 2. TND 3. GF 4. TSWLM 5. TWINE 6. OHMSS 7. LtK 8. TMWTGG 9. L&LD 10. YOLT 11. DAD 12. QoS 13. DN 14. GE 15. SF 16. OP 17. MR 18. AVTAK 19. TB 20. FRWL 21. CR 22. FYEO 23. DAF (SP to be included later)
    Bond actors to be re-ranked later
  • caractacus pottscaractacus potts Orbital communicator, level 10Posts: 2,350MI6 Agent
    edited May 2020
    PROS
    - Bond is back, finally.
    - Brosnan brought his own following of fans from Remington Steele, bringing a whole new demographic to the theatre to watch a Bondfilm (i.e. womenfolk)
    - Fans were showing off all their cool spy moves outside the theatre when I first saw the film, in the spirit of the lightsabre duels outside Star Wars movies. This was the most excited I ever saw civilians about a BondFilm since the Spy Who Loved Me, or anytime since.

    - Title references Fleming. Sounds like a BondTitle for those who don't know its source, and has extra authentic meaning for those who do.
    - The beach house Bond and Natalya inexplicably stop over at while searching for the satellite dish looks like Fleming's house! Subtle, but present.

    - No Fleming content per se, except for brief mention of Bond's parents' death and his orphan status (a first I think in the films).
    But the plot pastiches a lot from DaF especially, TB and NSNA, the opening of the volcano from YOLT, highspeed switchback flirting from both GF and OHMSS, casino pickups from both DN and OHMSS, even the mysterious eastern girl on the run from tLD!
    So it's sure got the parts to add up to a proper BondFilm!


    - Precredits shows us a previously Unseen Mission. I want to see more!
    Our pal number24 correctly explained this scene needs to be set 9 years earlier because of the end of the Cold War.

    - Presentday story begins with Bond requiring an assessment before being allowed to return to duty ... and when last seen in LtK he had gone dangerously rogue, so this opening connects the new adventure to the end of the last!

    - Judi Dench, delivers some biting dialog. Best M since the original (but she would get better in subsequent films)

    - Clever dialog that acknowledges the critiques of the genre while still allowing us to indulge shamelessly in the fantasy.


    - Xenia Onatopp, awesomely sexy and perverse bad girl. Somebody should make a mixtape of the sounds she makes.

    - Ourumov, always twitching inappropriately ... both these villains are dangerous weirdos barely in control of their impulses.
    I just recently watched Gottfried John in Berlin Alexanderplatz, where he was also the baddy. Apparantly he was in a lot of Fassbinder films. He plays sick and twisted very well.

    - Alex's train ... the dialog tells us that's where he lives and controls his evil empire.

    - "It's what keeps me alive". BrosnanBond will actually be the most philosophical of all the Bonds, we should give give him more credit for that. (though it is admittedly a lame line, it's more interesting than his attempts to quip).

    - Boris and the pen ... as per plot structure requirements, Q's gadget saves the day in the final scene, but Boris milks the suspense as never seen before and earns some real laffs while doing it.

    - "Come through in the clinch": required closing gag that also acknowledges its own purpose (as per the new self-aware dialog requirements). The bit at the end of every film where Bond gropes the girl as the credits start to roll is commonly referred to as "the final clinch".

    - Hints of more Unseen Missions:
    When did Bond give Valentin that limp?
    What were all these adventures when Bond and Alex "shared everything"?



    CONS
    - Cubby is no longer involved, nor are most of the classic behind the scenes team.
    - Very generic score.

    - New Bond makes his entrance in a men's restroom cubicle (and an occupied one at that)
    - The successful jump onto a moving airplane. MovieBond may be a superhero, but he still isn't supposed to be able to fly!

    - "Nine years later" could be interpreted as an attempt to wipe DaltonBond from history.


    - Brosnan plays the part like a department store mannequin.
    - Brosnan can't deliver the quips any better than Dalton could, but he keeps on trying. Please stop, Brosnan!
    - The usually deadpan Q bursts out laughing(!) at a particularly lame BrosnanBond quip ... which went on to be the title of a particularly lame theme song to a BondFilm decades later! Did somebody consider that to be a classic quote???

    - The latest Moneypenny is a scolding older sister.

    - Bond now drives a BMW.
    Bond's cars are supposed to be unobtainable fantasy vehicles, every last smug yuppy in the 90s drove a BMW!
    What's next, Bond drinks Heineken?

    - Once Natalya meets Bond, her every line of dialog is a metacommentary on the sexist cliches of the Bondfilm genre.
    - In general, the witty selfaware meta-dialog gets tiresome quickly, long before "You're like boys with toys".
    (though I wish "Wudda we have here, another stiff-ass Brit!" had been the actual password)

    - Many of the setpiece scenes drag on and on and on.

    - The tank chase, this isn't postCold War peace, it is Western Triumphalism.
    - The comparable MooreBond chase scenes did not approach a fraction of the property damage (that's a lot of very nice historic buildings he trashes), and MooreBond certainly did not spray a machine gun indiscriminantly at the local cops either. BrosnanBond is a very bad western tourist.

    - Alex is outclassed by his two henchpersons.
    - The potential of a fellow-double-oh-as-badguy is not really explored, except when Alex comments on Bond's psychology (that self-aware meta-dialog again).
    - It's never explained how he faked his death.

    - "Don't make this personal 007" ... like his last adventure or his next seven.
  • BarbelBarbel ScotlandPosts: 31,301Chief of Staff
    Knowledgeable review, cp, and good gags! (eg Heineken :)) )
  • HigginsHiggins GermanyPosts: 16,399MI6 Agent

    - "Nine years later" could be interpreted as an attempt to wipe DaltonBond from history.

    Right choice and highly necessary :D
    President of the 'Misty Eyes Club'.

    Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
  • Number24Number24 NorwayPosts: 17,920MI6 Agent
    No, it's just another nail in the coffin of the code name theory.
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