Personally, I don't think anything Richard has posted has been out of line, in fact, I think he has made some interesting, well thought out and thought provoking posts. So perhaps we could all just get back to discussing Bond films.
I previously stated that I thought CR was overrated, I will add that I think TSWLM is a little overrated. I like the film and it is one of the better Moore films, but some Bond fans list it as one of the best of all time, which I don't agree with. I will say it has one of the best PTS, but some of the scenes, like the underwater car and Bond dropping a fish out the window when they drive up on the beach are little too silly, to have TSWLM be one of the best.
DrFragmentSouth Coast Of EnglandPosts: 49MI6 Agent
Diamonds Are Forever, as a follow up to OHMSS, bloody awful film, and Bond in a pink tie !!
Personally, I don't think anything Richard has posted has been out of line, in fact, I think he has made some interesting, well thought out and thought provoking posts. So perhaps we could all just get back to discussing Bond films.
I previously stated that I thought CR was overrated, I will add that I think TSWLM is a little overrated. I like the film and it is one of the better Moore films, but some Bond fans list it as one of the best of all time, which I don't agree with. I will say it has one of the best PTS, but some of the scenes, like the underwater car and Bond dropping a fish out the window when they drive up on the beach are little too silly, to have TSWLM be one of the best.
I believe TSWLM has this special nostalgy factor for many viewers. It introduced Jaws, had Lotus in it and to my taste it's the most enjoyable Roger Moore Bond film. I grew up with this movie and even though not the finest cinema there is, it has everything that I expect from a Bond movie. In my book I don't consider any of the Bond movie a masterpiece or into top 1000 movies of alltime. When I watch Bond, I expect to be entertained 2 hours with a few laughs and good action, beautiful girls & locations, interesting villains and story. TSWLM pretty much has it all and gets a pick in my top 5.
It's funny, on other forums TSWLM is often slated but I think its great fun. One of the best "classic" Bond movies. It's even Roger Moore's favourite out of the ones he did.
I think one thing that makes it so memorable is the song. There is just something very timeless about it.
I do kind of agree about the fish-on-the-beach bit being silly - I suppose it was meant to be. However I always liked the submarine car.
This is all my personal opinion. I think that For Your Eyes Only is rather overrated, It's a decent movie. I liked how it shows some continuity with showing the grave site of Bond's wife. But I just don't see how this one is over say, The Man With the Golden Gun, which is my personal favorite Moore Bond film.
I would also have to say Diamonds Are Forever, I found this one kind of boring.
1, GE 2, CR 3, SF 4, TWINE 5, Spectre 6, TMWTGG 7, DAD 8, LALD 9, AVTAK 10, LTK 11, Octopussy 12, Moonraker 13, TLD 14, GF 15, QOS 16, Tomorrow 17, FYEO 18. TSWLM Not seen much: Dr. No, Russia, Thunderball, Twice, Majesty.
1: Brosnan 2: Craig 3: Moore 4: Dalton 5: Connery and 6: Lazenby
This is all my personal opinion. I think that For Your Eyes Only is rather overrated, It's a decent movie. I liked how it shows some continuity with showing the grave site of Bond's wife. But I just don't see how this one is over say, The Man With the Golden Gun, which is my personal favorite Moore Bond film.
I would also have to say Diamonds Are Forever, I found this one kind of boring.
TMWTGG is one of the most underrated Bonds, it's definitely one of my favorites. FYEO is rather good IMO, certainly brought some credibility to the series after Moonraker . Not that I dislike Moonraker, it's good fun.
I agree the attack on the castle by the "Bond Girls" was very tame ( Not how rough some women can fight!)
I don't mind the dressing as a clown, Although I do remember reading Roger Moore thought it went a little too far but was peursuaded to do it.
Much as I hated QOS, I do think the series needed a bit of a shake up ( But not the camera work ! ) after watching Octopussy again this weekend on TV. It did seem rather slow in places.
"I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
I can think of four straight away: GF, TB, TSWLM, and CR.
GF is widely considered one of the very best, and while I like it, it's not even close to the top for me.
TB is a very popular movie too, and this one is actually one of my least favourites. I like it and all, but I find it boring in places, and prefer most other bond movies to it.
TSWLM is widely considered Moore's best. I like this movie, but I prefer LALD, AVTAK, OP, and FYEO to it (And maybe even TMWTGG too, not 100% sure on that one though).
And CR.... Well, it's a good movie, but to me it's just not bond. It's well done, but it just isn't my cup of tea.
Goldfinger - Nice car, the immortal Honor Blackman, a benchmark setting henchman, and a larger than life supervillain, however Bond is in custody for nearly half the film and gets two women killed. It also has Bond slapping a lady's backside, which seems completely inappropriate these days.
Thunderball - The Sean Connery era gets a bit stale here, with dull underwater sequences, and SPECTRE's plan of hijacking a nuclear bomber being a bit modest in comparison to a SPECTRE rocket capturing space capsules and the Liparus swallowing entire nuclear submarines.
GoldenEye - It was adapted into one of the best FPS video games of all time and had two iconic Bond moments (the dam jump and tank chase), however it was as badly overwritten as Quantum of Solace was underwritten, and feels padded and meandering in places, with bigger than normal plotholes.
'Alright guard, begin the unnecessarily slow moving dipping mechanism...'
#1- Goldfinger. Take away Oddjob and Barry's score and it'd be basically junk with a few good lines.
#2- For Your Eyes Only. It only SEEMED that great because of Moonraker just before it.
#3- Moonraker. I simply do not understand the lack of disgust for this movie. I keep reading comments about it not being very good, some say it was fun in parts, others say it's low on their list, etc. This movie is SO over rated!!! It's not just the worst Bond movie, it's one of the worst movies PERIOD.
#3- Moonraker. I simply do not understand the lack of disgust for this movie. I keep reading comments about it not being very good, some say it was fun in parts, others say it's low on their list, etc. This movie is SO over rated!!! It's not just the worst Bond movie, it's one of the worst movies PERIOD.
Yes, Moonraker has a couple of the worst elements in the entire series. The Jaws/Dolly relationship is extremely cringeworthy and the laser fight in space is plain bad. But that does not make it the worst Bond movie, let alone one of the worst movies PERIOD? Just my opinion.
Great sets, locations, score, great scenes like the centrifuge, the pheasant shoot and Corinne Dufour's demise, some wonderful dialogue and good humour, and one of the most underrated title songs. No EON Bond film is rubbish, not even close. There is good stuff in all of them.
Moore Not Less 4371 posts (2002 - 2007) Moore Than (2012 - 2016)
#3- Moonraker. I simply do not understand the lack of disgust for this movie. I keep reading comments about it not being very good, some say it was fun in parts, others say it's low on their list, etc. This movie is SO over rated!!! It's not just the worst Bond movie, it's one of the worst movies PERIOD.
If you view it as an official Bond parody of a Roger Moore Bond movie, then it becomes enjoyable on a certain level.
Thunderball is overrated. In all my years as a Bond fan, I've never understood why so many rank it highly. After recently rewatching the film, I had hoped to change my perspective (like a recent reviewing of Dr No pushed that film into my top ten).
Sure, Thunderball has all the right elements: a great villain, good locations, an interesting setup and story, Fiona Volpe is a great femme fetale, the revenge subplot is interesting (although, like the character Domino, underused), Connery plays the role well and Barry provides one of his best scores. However, the plot is incoherent and the pacing schizophrenic in places. Like many of the Moore and Brosnan films, Bond is just a pawn, acting as an action figure who utilises gadgets rather than his wits to save himself, and not actually driving the plot forward himself (although there are some occasions when he utilises skill over gadgetry in this film).
Many fans complain about the slow pace and length of the underwater sequences, and while the final one is a little longer than necessary, it's not terrible.
The most glaring issue I have with Thunderball is that the film feels rushed, both in plot, especially the second half, and production. The film tries to be more than it is by doing too much and not developing any of it enough. Many of Bond's achievements are out of sync with what was established or achieved in previous scenes. This, I believe could have been resolved by expanding the film's length (like OHMSS) and giving each story element enough time to be fully explored rather than sweeping elements aside to make room for bigger and "better" ones in order to outdo Goldfinger.
Goldfinger is also overrated in my opinion. The film is not bad, however, fans rate it as the series' best, when I believe there are a couple of films that are better than it.
My main issue with Goldfinger (after a recent reviewing, in which I enjoyed it more than I remembered, even placing it one ranking higher in my list) is that the story sags while Bond is mostly inactive at Goldfinger's ranch (although once Bond is inside Fort Knox, the film becomes better), however, some of these scenes make up for it by being fun. My only other gripe with the film is the terrible casting of the actor who plays Felix Leiter.
The World is Not Enough is overrated as well. Like Thunderball, the plot is underdeveloped, and many elements could have been stronger, like the relationship between Bond and Elektra, and Renard as a more menacing villain. While Brosnan puts in what is probably his best performance as Bond, the film's pace is schizophrenic, with poor, if any links, between a lot of scenes. For example, when Bond and Elektra first end up in bed together, the previous scene showed them a little antagonistic towards each other. Why the sudden change in attitude towards each other? Did I miss something? I think scenes were cut.
And don't get me started on Denise Richards' credibility as a nuclear scientist. Obviously she was chosen for her looks (which I can't complain about ).
TMWTGG is one of the most underrated Bonds, it's definitely one of my favorites.
I agree. The Man with the Golden Gun gets a lot of flack, and is often cited as one of the worst in the series (even by the producers!). While there are certainly some dud elements in it (the most prominent being J.W. Pepper, the slide whistle, and the jacket Bond wears on Scaramanga's island - this, more than anything, severely dates the film), it's still an enjoyable movie that deviates in an interesting manner from the standard Bond formula. Moore even plays the role much darker/tougher than in any of his other Bond films. I'm not saying it's one of the series' best films, but I think it's more enjoyable than several number of others.
The Spy Who Loved Me. It is well liked on here, but I struggle to understand why. Personally, I don't even think it was Moore's best film, let alone the series' best. In terms of Moore's films, I thought that Live and Let Die and For Your Eyes Only were both better than The Spy Who Loved Me, which, in my list of favourite Bond films, ranks 19 out of 22.
My main issue with The Spy Who Loved Me is not so much the plot as the execution. I thought the person who played Stromberg was boring and monotonous, nor did Barbara Bach make a believable Soviet Army officer or a Soviet Agent due to her lack of fighting ability and the ease with which she was overpowered. Her "code name" - "XXX" - is there a more generic code name in the business? How long did the writers spend on that, I wonder ... seriously!
Diamonds are Forever
Great title song but that's it in my opinion.
Charles Grey as Blofeld does not work when compared
to Donald and Telly.
It's actually more silly than some of the Roger Moore ones.
Goldfinger, IMO. Even though it's in my personal top five, I have always maintained it's simultaneously possible to both consider a film legitimately great AND to overrate it at the same time. A non-Bond example would be Gone with the Wind; I (and many serious critics) have always believed Citizen Kaine was a better-done film when one considers the time period, but does that really detract all that much from Gone with the Wind?
This phenomenon goes FAR beyond Bond films. For example, ever since I've been very young, I've been a huge fan of the Marx Brothers. In the 1960's, critics ranked A Night at the Opera in the top twenty (sometimes top ten) films of all time, yet the almost-as-good A Day at the Races was lucky to wind up in the top 100. To this day, A Night at the Opera is usually found in the top 100 comedies. The reason for this is actually pretty simple: Irving Thalberg is credited as the producer for the former and Sam Wood is credited as the producer for the latter (and with the exception of Thalberg, it's generally acknowledged among Marx Brothers fans like myself that MGM badly hurt the Marx Brothers, with the notable exception of Thalberg). However, it later came to light that Thalberg was indeed extensively involved in making A Day at the Races and in fact died during filming. And, sure enough, all the critics started adjusting their lists to ramp up A Day at the Races on the top 100 (I know it cracked some top 50 lists at the time). It was like they'd just seen the film for the first time, although obviously they hadn't. Whether they were underrating A Day at the Races, overrating A Night at the Opera, or both (probably) is debatable...both movies, to a Marx Brothers fan like me, are hugely enjoyable and among the great comedies of all time.
FYEO and OP are not what I'd consider overrated......among the hard core fans , prolly , but not among the average Joes , in fact then it leans more towards the underrated scale.
GF is indeed overrated though.
TB might drag somewhat but gimme that over the chore-to-watch TWINE *any* day (didn't care for plot/villain or the girls , boat , parachute and the theme were decent though....also why kill off the Russian , he was likeable 8-)
FRWL might be slow but at least it takes it's time to create atmosphere , unlike say YOLT where it's like "let's wrap it up and get it over with !"
Thunderball is very slow. It has a great Bond feel and is probably the series at its peak, but they tried to put a little too much in and it does get a little dull at times. Those bloody underwater bits... <yawn>
Usually I love Barrys music but the underwater cues are used a bit too much........that is one reason why the underwater scenes drag.
Comments
I previously stated that I thought CR was overrated, I will add that I think TSWLM is a little overrated. I like the film and it is one of the better Moore films, but some Bond fans list it as one of the best of all time, which I don't agree with. I will say it has one of the best PTS, but some of the scenes, like the underwater car and Bond dropping a fish out the window when they drive up on the beach are little too silly, to have TSWLM be one of the best.
Roger Moore 1927-2017
If you would care to PM me with the members you claim to be abusive...with links to those posts...I'll happily look into if for you.
Yes...that's easily done
I believe there is a way to generate a 'random' IP address...so that's not strictly true anymore.
I believe TSWLM has this special nostalgy factor for many viewers. It introduced Jaws, had Lotus in it and to my taste it's the most enjoyable Roger Moore Bond film. I grew up with this movie and even though not the finest cinema there is, it has everything that I expect from a Bond movie. In my book I don't consider any of the Bond movie a masterpiece or into top 1000 movies of alltime. When I watch Bond, I expect to be entertained 2 hours with a few laughs and good action, beautiful girls & locations, interesting villains and story. TSWLM pretty much has it all and gets a pick in my top 5.
I think one thing that makes it so memorable is the song. There is just something very timeless about it.
I do kind of agree about the fish-on-the-beach bit being silly - I suppose it was meant to be. However I always liked the submarine car.
1. Dalton 2. Moore 3. Connery 4. Craig 5. Lazenby 6. Brosnan
I would also have to say Diamonds Are Forever, I found this one kind of boring.
1: Brosnan 2: Craig 3: Moore 4: Dalton 5: Connery and 6: Lazenby
That's true!
almost forgot.
But seriously, IMO, too clownesk. Disappointing theme, Bond-girls, Soundtrack, Q in that balloon...
I don't mind the dressing as a clown, Although I do remember reading Roger Moore thought it went a little too far but was peursuaded to do it.
Much as I hated QOS, I do think the series needed a bit of a shake up ( But not the camera work !
Moore: The Spy Who Loved Me
Brosnan: Goldeneye
GF is widely considered one of the very best, and while I like it, it's not even close to the top for me.
TB is a very popular movie too, and this one is actually one of my least favourites. I like it and all, but I find it boring in places, and prefer most other bond movies to it.
TSWLM is widely considered Moore's best. I like this movie, but I prefer LALD, AVTAK, OP, and FYEO to it (And maybe even TMWTGG too, not 100% sure on that one though).
And CR.... Well, it's a good movie, but to me it's just not bond. It's well done, but it just isn't my cup of tea.
1 - Moore, 2 - Dalton, 3 - Craig, 4 - Connery, 5 - Brosnan, 6 - Lazenby
Thunderball - The Sean Connery era gets a bit stale here, with dull underwater sequences, and SPECTRE's plan of hijacking a nuclear bomber being a bit modest in comparison to a SPECTRE rocket capturing space capsules and the Liparus swallowing entire nuclear submarines.
GoldenEye - It was adapted into one of the best FPS video games of all time and had two iconic Bond moments (the dam jump and tank chase), however it was as badly overwritten as Quantum of Solace was underwritten, and feels padded and meandering in places, with bigger than normal plotholes.
#2- For Your Eyes Only. It only SEEMED that great because of Moonraker just before it.
#3- Moonraker. I simply do not understand the lack of disgust for this movie. I keep reading comments about it not being very good, some say it was fun in parts, others say it's low on their list, etc. This movie is SO over rated!!! It's not just the worst Bond movie, it's one of the worst movies PERIOD.
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
Yes, Moonraker has a couple of the worst elements in the entire series. The Jaws/Dolly relationship is extremely cringeworthy and the laser fight in space is plain bad. But that does not make it the worst Bond movie, let alone one of the worst movies PERIOD? Just my opinion.
Great sets, locations, score, great scenes like the centrifuge, the pheasant shoot and Corinne Dufour's demise, some wonderful dialogue and good humour, and one of the most underrated title songs. No EON Bond film is rubbish, not even close. There is good stuff in all of them.
If you view it as an official Bond parody of a Roger Moore Bond movie, then it becomes enjoyable on a certain level.
Looks like someone needs an introduction to Ed Wood, Tony Malinowski, Arch Hall Sr., Coleman Francis, Hal Warren...
Sure, Thunderball has all the right elements: a great villain, good locations, an interesting setup and story, Fiona Volpe is a great femme fetale, the revenge subplot is interesting (although, like the character Domino, underused), Connery plays the role well and Barry provides one of his best scores. However, the plot is incoherent and the pacing schizophrenic in places. Like many of the Moore and Brosnan films, Bond is just a pawn, acting as an action figure who utilises gadgets rather than his wits to save himself, and not actually driving the plot forward himself (although there are some occasions when he utilises skill over gadgetry in this film).
Many fans complain about the slow pace and length of the underwater sequences, and while the final one is a little longer than necessary, it's not terrible.
The most glaring issue I have with Thunderball is that the film feels rushed, both in plot, especially the second half, and production. The film tries to be more than it is by doing too much and not developing any of it enough. Many of Bond's achievements are out of sync with what was established or achieved in previous scenes. This, I believe could have been resolved by expanding the film's length (like OHMSS) and giving each story element enough time to be fully explored rather than sweeping elements aside to make room for bigger and "better" ones in order to outdo Goldfinger.
Goldfinger is also overrated in my opinion. The film is not bad, however, fans rate it as the series' best, when I believe there are a couple of films that are better than it.
My main issue with Goldfinger (after a recent reviewing, in which I enjoyed it more than I remembered, even placing it one ranking higher in my list) is that the story sags while Bond is mostly inactive at Goldfinger's ranch (although once Bond is inside Fort Knox, the film becomes better), however, some of these scenes make up for it by being fun. My only other gripe with the film is the terrible casting of the actor who plays Felix Leiter.
The World is Not Enough is overrated as well. Like Thunderball, the plot is underdeveloped, and many elements could have been stronger, like the relationship between Bond and Elektra, and Renard as a more menacing villain. While Brosnan puts in what is probably his best performance as Bond, the film's pace is schizophrenic, with poor, if any links, between a lot of scenes. For example, when Bond and Elektra first end up in bed together, the previous scene showed them a little antagonistic towards each other. Why the sudden change in attitude towards each other? Did I miss something? I think scenes were cut.
And don't get me started on Denise Richards' credibility as a nuclear scientist. Obviously she was chosen for her looks (which I can't complain about
8. TSWLM 9. TMwtGG 10. AVtaK 11. SF 12. TND 13. LtK 14. NTtD
15. MR 16. LaLD 17. YOLT 18. GF 19. DN 20. SP 21. TWiNE
22. TB 23. DAD 24. QoS 25. DaF
I agree. The Man with the Golden Gun gets a lot of flack, and is often cited as one of the worst in the series (even by the producers!). While there are certainly some dud elements in it (the most prominent being J.W. Pepper, the slide whistle, and the jacket Bond wears on Scaramanga's island - this, more than anything, severely dates the film), it's still an enjoyable movie that deviates in an interesting manner from the standard Bond formula. Moore even plays the role much darker/tougher than in any of his other Bond films. I'm not saying it's one of the series' best films, but I think it's more enjoyable than several number of others.
8. TSWLM 9. TMwtGG 10. AVtaK 11. SF 12. TND 13. LtK 14. NTtD
15. MR 16. LaLD 17. YOLT 18. GF 19. DN 20. SP 21. TWiNE
22. TB 23. DAD 24. QoS 25. DaF
My main issue with The Spy Who Loved Me is not so much the plot as the execution. I thought the person who played Stromberg was boring and monotonous, nor did Barbara Bach make a believable Soviet Army officer or a Soviet Agent due to her lack of fighting ability and the ease with which she was overpowered. Her "code name" - "XXX" - is there a more generic code name in the business? How long did the writers spend on that, I wonder ... seriously!
Great title song but that's it in my opinion.
Charles Grey as Blofeld does not work when compared
to Donald and Telly.
It's actually more silly than some of the Roger Moore ones.
This phenomenon goes FAR beyond Bond films. For example, ever since I've been very young, I've been a huge fan of the Marx Brothers. In the 1960's, critics ranked A Night at the Opera in the top twenty (sometimes top ten) films of all time, yet the almost-as-good A Day at the Races was lucky to wind up in the top 100. To this day, A Night at the Opera is usually found in the top 100 comedies. The reason for this is actually pretty simple: Irving Thalberg is credited as the producer for the former and Sam Wood is credited as the producer for the latter (and with the exception of Thalberg, it's generally acknowledged among Marx Brothers fans like myself that MGM badly hurt the Marx Brothers, with the notable exception of Thalberg). However, it later came to light that Thalberg was indeed extensively involved in making A Day at the Races and in fact died during filming. And, sure enough, all the critics started adjusting their lists to ramp up A Day at the Races on the top 100 (I know it cracked some top 50 lists at the time). It was like they'd just seen the film for the first time, although obviously they hadn't. Whether they were underrating A Day at the Races, overrating A Night at the Opera, or both (probably) is debatable...both movies, to a Marx Brothers fan like me, are hugely enjoyable and among the great comedies of all time.
GF is indeed overrated though.
TB might drag somewhat but gimme that over the chore-to-watch TWINE *any* day (didn't care for plot/villain or the girls , boat , parachute and the theme were decent though....also why kill off the Russian , he was likeable 8-)
FRWL might be slow but at least it takes it's time to create atmosphere , unlike say YOLT where it's like "let's wrap it up and get it over with !"
Usually I love Barrys music but the underwater cues are used a bit too much........that is one reason why the underwater scenes drag.