Novel 6 Suggestion & Criticism Thread

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  • deliciousdelicious SydneyPosts: 371MI6 Agent
    I removed a line from an early draft where Max asks Cobra - "Does she know you are still alive?" but didnt want to add too many twists. Because Cobra is a bad guy he might end up doing a Valentin Zuchovsky and saving Bond/Daya at the expense of his own life. I dont think Daya should die but Cobra might and there would be a lot of pathos if he was saving his sister. We dont know at this point how daya feels about Cobra - she might hate him for instance because of his work etc or maybe he did something to hurt their family.

    But I hope Baker can be killed - I hate Aussies! ;o)
  • The Sly FoxThe Sly Fox USAPosts: 467MI6 Agent
    edited July 2007
    delicious wrote:
    I removed a line from an early draft where Max asks Cobra - "Does she know you are still alive?" but didnt want to add too many twists. Because Cobra is a bad guy he might end up doing a Valentin Zuchovsky and saving Bond/Daya at the expense of his own life. I dont think Daya should die but Cobra might and there would be a lot of pathos if he was saving his sister. We dont know at this point how daya feels about Cobra - she might hate him for instance because of his work etc or maybe he did something to hurt their family.

    But I hope Baker can be killed - I hate Aussies! ;o)

    True, we don't know what Cobra has done. Perhaps he may have done something truly horrible in his past, making him a troubled individual like Max. A sort of reconciliation between brother and sister would be nice though, and such a troubled past could be used as a plot device to achieve this. Although really, I'll be happy as long as we don't pull a Tilly Masterson, e.g. Goldfinger...

    I wonder who Baker really is... Joe Don Baker, perhaps? :D

    "Jack Wade, CIA."
    "James Bond, stiff-a** Brit." :))

    By the way, aren't you an Aussie yourself, delicious, or is there another Sydney somewhere that I don't know about? ;)
  • deliciousdelicious SydneyPosts: 371MI6 Agent

    By the way, aren't you an Aussie yourself, delicious, or is there another Sydney somewhere that I don't know about? ;)

    I am indeed but its a love-hate relationship. Aussies tend to put themselves (and everyone else) down - its part of the culture. {[]
  • Golrush007Golrush007 South AfricaPosts: 3,421Quartermasters
    edited July 2007
    I am about half way through writing my contribution, but that's all I will have time for today. I should finish it and post it by tomorrow.
  • darenhatdarenhat The Old PuebloPosts: 2,029Quartermasters
    Based on where the story is going...is Baker going to be the individual Carter was working with at VoxBrahma, and thus working for X? Or is Baker going to be X's rival who is being set-up by X to meet Bond?
  • Golrush007Golrush007 South AfricaPosts: 3,421Quartermasters
    edited July 2007
    As I understand it, Baker is one of X's underlings (he runs VoxBrahma), and X is using him as a decoy. He is setting up Baker, so that Bond will think that he has killed X. At least, this is how I am writing it in my contribution. If I have got the wrong end of the stick please let me know! ;)
  • darenhatdarenhat The Old PuebloPosts: 2,029Quartermasters
    Golrush007 wrote:
    As I understand it, Baker is one of X's underlings (he runs VoxBrahma), and X is using him as a decoy. He is setting up Baker, so that Bond will think that he has killed X. At least, this is how I am writing it in my contribution. If I have got the wrong end of the stick please let me know! ;)

    That sound like it would work...as long as Baker doesn't squeal on X like Carter did when he's confronted by Bond. And I don't think Bond would make the unprofessional decision of eliminating Baker without confirming that he is indeed the target.

    You've got things right, Golrush. I'm just overthinking (I think). :)
  • deliciousdelicious SydneyPosts: 371MI6 Agent
    Perhaps Cobra could shadow Baker and Bond and if Baker starts spilling the beans about X Cobra could shoot Baker (rifle with telescopic sights etc).

    The evidence that Cobra plants in Baker's office will need to be pretty convincing for Bond to go after Baker as X is no fool. Perhaps Bond interrogates Baker, Baker gets shot by Cobra, Bond pursues Cobra, catches him (or finds him later) and then Cobra changes sides. Lots of possibilities...
  • Golrush007Golrush007 South AfricaPosts: 3,421Quartermasters
    I have posted my latest contribution. I hope that you feel it is up to scratch.
  • darenhatdarenhat The Old PuebloPosts: 2,029Quartermasters
    Beautiful, Golrush! Absolutely beautiful!
    You've done an excellent job, putting Bond and Daya on the wrong scent...I can see the title of the next chapter already: "Up the Garden Path". Good work.

    FYI: This will probably be my last post for a bit, as I'm about to hit the road on my vacation. I'm scheduled to be back late on Saturday the 28th. I'll check back in as soon as I can! Cheers, all {[]
  • The Sly FoxThe Sly Fox USAPosts: 467MI6 Agent
    edited July 2007
    Golrush, your entry is fantastic! Lots of cool imagery there! I believe I have an idea as to where to take the story from here, although I do have a question: does the Garden Path have any significance other than a name? I'm afraid I'm not familiar enough with India to know about these things, but does it have a religious connotation like VoxBrahma? Mythological perhaps?

    The only thing that comes to mind with a Garden Path is that it's a long walkway leading to some sort of mansion--a mansion that belongs to yet another someone set to trip Bond up, possibly Cobra. Perhaps the hard drive could have some sort of data on it (data that Cobra didn't see) that will lead Bond into thinking that Cobra is Mister X, although that might advance the story too far and too early. I don't know what the consensus is, so I believe I'll wait to write on that part. In any case, I believe I'll take Bond back to Q Branch to have Q examine the drive.

    I can see this story leading to many twists and turns set up by Mister X as obstacles in a cat-and-mouse game. Eventually we may get someone like Cobra to straighten the trail for Bond... But I'm probably thinking way too far ahead. :)

    By the way, I'd be happy to take over for darenhat during his absence as previously discussed, so long as everyone else agrees to it. :)
  • Golrush007Golrush007 South AfricaPosts: 3,421Quartermasters
    Golrush, your entry is fantastic! Lots of cool imagery there! I believe I have an idea as to where to take the story from here, although I do have a question: does the Garden Path have any significance other than a name? I'm afraid I'm not familiar enough with India to know about these things, but does it have a religious connotation like VoxBrahma? Mythological perhaps?

    I didn't write that with any sort of double meaning in mind, but if there is one (?) then by all means lets incorporate it into the tale.
  • deliciousdelicious SydneyPosts: 371MI6 Agent
    darenhat wrote:

    That sound like it would work...as long as Baker doesn't squeal on X like Carter did when he's confronted by Bond.

    I knew Carter would never willingly blab anything to Bond which is why I used the head wound idea to addle Carter's brains so that he would let something slip. A lucky break for Bond which he sometimes needs.
  • deliciousdelicious SydneyPosts: 371MI6 Agent
    Death has No Name
    Death Has No Past
    Death has No Memory

    Possible titles that came to me lat night.
  • deliciousdelicious SydneyPosts: 371MI6 Agent
    Also Death Mask
  • deliciousdelicious SydneyPosts: 371MI6 Agent
    edited July 2007
    Golrush can you make Tom Baker more attractive looking - he is Australian after all. ;)
  • Golrush007Golrush007 South AfricaPosts: 3,421Quartermasters
    delicious wrote:
    Golrush can you make Tom Baker more attractive looking - he is Australian after all. ;)

    I thought you hated Aussies?? ;) He wasn't particularly ugly was he? - he just had a wrinkled face.
  • deliciousdelicious SydneyPosts: 371MI6 Agent
    So who is next - is it Willy Garvin bcause Sly Fox is away?
  • The Sly FoxThe Sly Fox USAPosts: 467MI6 Agent
    No, I'm not away, I'm right here. ;) I'm taking over for darenhat when his turn comes up, since he's the one who's away. I'm busy writing my bit at this very moment. I think I'm going to take Bond back to MI6 headquarters in London, in which he runs into Adrianna, who has infiltrated MI6 by impersonating as Bond. (!) There will be a rather interesting meeting in M's office... Or does all that sound too far out there? :)
  • Golrush007Golrush007 South AfricaPosts: 3,421Quartermasters
    Adrianna as Bond? That does sound quite far out! I'm not hugely keen on the idea, but this is a team, so let's see what the general opinion is before ruling anything out.
  • deliciousdelicious SydneyPosts: 371MI6 Agent
    Im with you Golrush. I like Adriana as a character but I was never a big fond of baba yaga being a disguise either. i just wanted her to be a horrible old Finnish woman who worked for Mister X. Perhaps when Mister X finds out that Cobra had to kill Baker and Bond is on his way back to London, he sets something up to discredit Bond and muddy the waters. But whoever impersonates Bond should be a man I think.
  • Willie GarvinWillie Garvin Posts: 1,412MI6 Agent
    edited July 2007
    We can always revise things so that Baba Yaga is just a horrible old Finnish woman.I've no problem with that at all.Altering my deathless prose wouldn't bother me a bit.Max might still have a few women working for him one of whom can be named Adriana--or not.It's up to you guys, just say the word.:)

    Two brief questions:

    Should Max even have a girlfriend,or is that now too much of a cliche?

    Is Obsidian a real name or is it an alias Max has assumed?I'm thinking--and this is only an idea--perhaps Max created the distinctive "Obsidian" surname.It might be symbolic:a veiled reference to the darkness that currently blocks any knowledge he has of his earliest life....up to and including his actual name.

    * * * *

    Some thoughts on Adriana.She's a former circus wirewalker,acrobat and contortionist.Like all Bond women--especially those on the opposite side of the ledger--she's beautiful,intelligent and dangerous.And of course,she's instensely loyal to Max Obsidian.In fact,she's probably in love with him.

    Some years ago, Max caught Adriana in the midst of stealing one of his priceless Etruscan jars from what was thought to be the most secure room in his villa in Spain(this occuring during a lavish party).Impressed by her abilities,and rather than turn Adriana over to the police,Max chose to put her in his employ.Adriana's very good at disguising herself and can go places a man cannot.She's lured more than one of Max's enemies to his death.She's an excellent spy and an equally skillful killer.

    To a certain degree,Max and Adrianna are drawn together because they're both alone in the world.Like Max,she never knew where she came from--but unlike Max,Adriana doesn't want to know about her past.

    They're occasional lovers, although it's loosely understood that Max really doesn't have the time or inclination to become emotionally involved with anyone--particularly when he's still absorbed in the search for information regarding his early life.At any rate,Adriana offers Max someone he can share some of his more intimate thoughts with during the darkest periods of stress and loneliness that threaten to envelop him.

    How's this sound?Opinions,please.
  • Golrush007Golrush007 South AfricaPosts: 3,421Quartermasters
    I do think that Adriana being a master of disguise is a fantastic idea, as long as she doesn't try and pretend to be Bond, as I simply can't believe that she could fool anybody at MI6 - especially people like M, Moneypenny or Tanner.

    As far as the 'character' of Baba Yaga is concerned - I do like the idea of this being one of Adriana's false personas.

    What do others feel?
  • The Sly FoxThe Sly Fox USAPosts: 467MI6 Agent
    edited July 2007
    I'm glad I waited to write it, then... :) I had a feeling Adrianna posing as Bond would sound a bit Die Another Day-ish, so I thought I'd run it by you guys first. I am working on it though and I should have something for you guys by tonight.

    When Bond gets back to MI6, something has to be waiting for him, whether it's discrediting information, or if it's someone impersonating him altogether. If it's an impersonator though, we would have to make sure that M catches it before Bond even gets there. As Golrush has said, she's certainly seen Bond enough to know him when she sees him. With that, I'm beginning to think the whole impersonation-of-Bond idea is too far out, so I think Bond should probably just have some sort of issue to deal with back at MI6. For example, someone on the inside may have planted documents in his computer, secret information that was classified to Bond's eyes. This would lead to a confrontation between M and Bond, with Bond asking M: "Just what do you know that I don't?," which could further deepen the story. This would also create a mole inside MI6 that even M doesn't know about.

    Sounds more believable in my opinion, and it leaves a lot of fun ideas for us to play around with later. Albeit, I did come up with the Adrianna impersonating Bond idea at around three in the morning... ;%

    By the way, those are some excellent ideas about Adrianna, WG (is it Adrianna or Adriana?). We'll have to be sure to incorporate those somewhere into the plot. I always did like the idea of Baba Yaga being one of the many alter-egos of Adrianna. I thought it might be a good idea to bring her back into the story, but is it too early for that? Perhaps she, herself is the mole in MI6... Some ideas to expand on later.

    What do you guys think? :)
  • Willie GarvinWillie Garvin Posts: 1,412MI6 Agent
    edited July 2007
    Thanks,Fox.

    Oops...Let's spell her name like this:Adriana.Two Ns looks cumbersome to me.:)
  • deliciousdelicious SydneyPosts: 371MI6 Agent
    We can always revise things so that Baba Yaga is just a horrible old Finnish woman.I've no problem with that at all.Altering my deathless prose wouldn't bother me a bit.Max might still have a few women working for him one of whom can be named Adriana--or not.It's up to you guys, just say the word.:).

    We will all need to be prepared to do that as we wont get the plot or characters right the first time round.
    Two brief questions:

    Should Max even have a girlfriend,or is that now too much of a cliche?

    Based on the excellent portrait of Adriana in your last post I think she is ideal to be Max's love interest. Max would get some solace from a woman who doesn't WANT to remember her past, since he is fixated on remembering his own.

    Is Obsidian a real name or is it an alias Max has assumed?I'm thinking--and this is only an idea--perhaps Max created the distinctive "Obsidian" surname.It might be symbolic:a veiled reference to the darkness that currently blocks any knowledge he has of his earliest life....up to and including his actual name.

    The name just came to me when I was first sketching him - Max knows his family background (who his parents were etc) but he cant remember his childhood before the age of 15. I had a vague idea that his father Obsidian Senior was some kind of magnate/captain of industry who had some dealings with the underworld. Perhaps someone else could sketch his parents more fully.
  • The Sly FoxThe Sly Fox USAPosts: 467MI6 Agent
    edited July 2007
    delicious wrote:
    The name just came to me when I was first sketching him - Max knows his family background (who his parents were etc) but he cant remember his childhood before the age of 15. I had a vague idea that his father Obsidian Senior was some kind of magnate/captain of industry who had some dealings with the underworld. Perhaps someone else could sketch his parents more fully.

    The first part of my contribution is in now. It's a bit rough right now, and I'll expand on it later. I'm going to add a dialogue scene with M and Bond, not to mention adding some details to what's already been written. Hope you like it so far. :) Later, I may need someone to help expand on the surroundings of the London Heathrow Airport, as I've never actually been there... :P

    By the way, the ending remark is a reference to Sir Godfrey Tibbett of A View to a Kill, (he was a colonel, wasn't he?) with the "call for help" reference being to the old femme fatale, Mayday. If you guys don't like it, I'll remove it. :)
  • The Sly FoxThe Sly Fox USAPosts: 467MI6 Agent
    edited July 2007
    All right, my whole entry has been posted. If it poses too many questions or complicates the story, I can change it partially or even completely. Does it perhaps sound too serious for this story, should it sound more light-hearted? Does it add too much of a plot twist?

    I'm willing to change it if you guys don't like it. Your opinions? :)
  • Golrush007Golrush007 South AfricaPosts: 3,421Quartermasters
    Nice work, Sly. (although i admit that I didn't expect to see Bond back in London so soon).

    Just one question (curiosity, that's all): the name Tanaka is your last entry - is that just coincidence or is it somehow connected to Tiger Tanaka from YOLT?
  • The Sly FoxThe Sly Fox USAPosts: 467MI6 Agent
    Good question, Golrush. There's no connection there. The only reason I used Tanaka is because it's a very common name. It's kind of like Smith in the US. Of course, if a future writer wants to create a connection, they're more than welcome to. :)

    I brought Bond back to London because I knew he needed to bring the hard drive back to Q branch for examination. But if it's too soon, we can switch things around and push my entry toward a later point in the story for the final draft.
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