While I agree that a comparable fitness level should not be a pre-requisite, I understand why Craig (a good deal shorter than the other Bonds) took that approach. Next to Craig, Lazenby and (early) Connery were both the most fit and the most convincing in a fight. There is an obvious correlation there.
I actually would prefer the next Bond actor to NOT look like he spends hours in the gym lifting weights. I prefer him to look more like a reasonably fit regular guy. Fleming's Bond swam, did push-ups, leg lifts and stretches. He didn't necessarily look like The Hulk in a suit.
Fleming's Bond also was a character from the 50's, that was a sexist and misogynist.
In todays day and age of movies I don't think that would pass.
Pussy Galore: “My name is Pussy Galore.”
Bond: “I must be dreaming.”
There's looking fit and having the requisite fitness, I don't think looking like you hit the gym daily is essential per say, but a modern bond would have to pass medical and fitness evaluations and be physically fit enough to embark in hand to hand combat. krav maga would be the discipline preferred nowadays.
I actually would prefer the next Bond actor to NOT look like he spends hours in the gym lifting weights. I prefer him to look more like a reasonably fit regular guy. Fleming's Bond swam, did push-ups, leg lifts and stretches. He didn't necessarily look like The Hulk in a suit.
Fleming's Bond also was a character from the 50's, that was a sexist and misogynist.
In todays day and age of movies I don't think that would pass.
So you don't think Bond looking like a man who keeps himself in great shape but doesn't look like the Hulk would not pass today either?
Today's standard for fitness and cinematic body image is different than the 60's, 70's. Craig certainly compensated for his "average" height with an imposing physique in CR but there probably was more to it. IMO, the level of muscularity (which was less so in subsequent films) also was to accentuate the "blunt instrument" that the newly commissioned "00" was. A Tom Hiddleston Bond would be more toward the long and lean Brosnan type physique, whereas Aidan Turner would resemble the shorter, stockier Craig.
I actually would prefer the next Bond actor to NOT look like he spends hours in the gym lifting weights. I prefer him to look more like a reasonably fit regular guy. Fleming's Bond swam, did push-ups, leg lifts and stretches. He didn't necessarily look like The Hulk in a suit.
Fleming's Bond also was a character from the 50's, that was a sexist and misogynist.
In todays day and age of movies I don't think that would pass.
So you don't think Bond looking like a man who keeps himself in great shape but doesn't look like the Hulk would not pass today either?
Not one actor that's ever played Bond has looked like the Hulk. Not even Craig in CR. While he was big in that movie, he was not even close to being considered Hulk like.
If you've seen the physiques of todays elite military personnel, you'd know that Craig in CR was far closer to reality and it would be this sort of military background that he would have been chosen from.
Someone with the physiques of Moore or Brosnan today, would not be able to make it as a special forces operative.
Pussy Galore: “My name is Pussy Galore.”
Bond: “I must be dreaming.”
Sir MilesThe Wrong Side Of The WardrobePosts: 26,605Chief of Staff
I think looking very fit it pretty much a prerequisite for contemporary action stars, not just Bond. I think it's a bit overstated regarding Craig's physique. The only film he really looked "pumped" was CR. The other three films he had what could be described as a middle or Light Heavyweight boxer's type physique. Also, I guess I was being a little too vague about what "Bond shape" is. "Bond shape" also means to get in good physical condition to be able to endure the great physicality of the role, to learn how to properly handle and fire weapons so you look convincing on screen, to get some hand to hand combat training so you actually look like James Bond in a fight.
Pierce was the lightest and the heaviest Bond. He may not have been quite the physical specimen but he always looked fit and he moved well in fight scenes and handled weapons relatively well, at least "movie well". With regards to the chest hair, chest hair no problem; man boobs: big problem. )
We're certainly not talking man boobs... not even Craig in CR had them! )
Fleming's Bond also was a character from the 50's, that was a sexist and misogynist.
In todays day and age of movies I don't think that would pass.
So you don't think Bond looking like a man who keeps himself in great shape but doesn't look like the Hulk would not pass today either?
Not one actor that's ever played Bond has looked like the Hulk. Not even Craig in CR. While he was big in that movie, he was not even close to being considered Hulk like.
If you've seen the physiques of todays elite military personnel, you'd know that Craig in CR was far closer to reality and it would be this sort of military background that he would have been chosen from.
Someone with the physiques of Moore or Brosnan today, would not be able to make it as a special forces operative.
Agreed 100%
Personally, if someone's job is to eliminate a target they would not be a professional if they expected a bullet to be the only way of doing it. If they did they would not be at the job very long.
Realistically (IMO) if someone is supposed to eliminate a target they better be prepared physically to handle it with their bare hands and Craig was believable in that respect.
Moore or Brosnan I wouldn't even feel worried about.
Someone with the physiques of Moore or Brosnan today, would not be able to make it as a special forces operative.
That's not true at all. SF look like normal people, at least in the UK. For the most part you'd never in a million years mark them as SAS, SBS or SRR etc. In the US the physique of SF is very different though.
Intact in NI during the height of the troubles if you tipped up there looking like you hit the gym 7 days a week, with a buzz cut sticking your chest out you were initially put on Base duties.
In films today there seems to be an infatuation with actors getting all buffed up for action roles, especially if it involves Navy Seals, Special Forces or any type of Special Ops. The reality is, in the US Military today there is a strong workout culture and there have also been rumblings of the abuse of PED's, over the counter supplements and stimulants. I'm not saying that this exists in epidemic proportions but it does exist to some degree. With regard to British Special Forces, I recently watched a series of documentaries on the British Commandos during WWII. It was interesting to see what a diverse lot these exceptional men were. Educated men from the upper classes, working class, men with criminal backgrounds. Many of them appeared to be built like small to medium sized prize fighters. I don't think there was as much of a fixation on height and size in the British Military. In the US Military and the US for many years in jobs like the Police Dept or even driving a public bus there were height minimums. My father had a perfect or near perfect score on every test he took to become a bus driver including the behind the wheel test but was ultimately turned down due to being a half inch under the 5'7" height requirement. But back in those days they could also discriminate based upon race or gender also.
You don't have to have very prominent muscles to be able to fight well. In fact, a secret agent should be able to fight without drawing people attention to their muscles. If you think of many martial arts masters, they are very good at what they do but they rely on many things other than pure muscle force.
You don't have to have very prominent muscles to be able to fight well. In fact, a secret agent should be able to fight without drawing people attention to their muscles. If you think of many martial arts masters, they are very good at what they do but they rely on many things other than pure muscle force.
Except Craig's Bond is not a martial arts master. He uses his fighting skills and brute force to win his fights.
Pussy Galore: “My name is Pussy Galore.”
Bond: “I must be dreaming.”
You don't have to have very prominent muscles to be able to fight well. In fact, a secret agent should be able to fight without drawing people attention to their muscles. If you think of many martial arts masters, they are very good at what they do but they rely on many things other than pure muscle force.
Except Craig's Bond is not a martial arts master. He uses his fighting skills and brute force to win his fights.
Only in his "blunt instrument" incarnation... other Bonds also use any tools they can find (including Bond's own urine!), some martial arts training and their wit too.
What you find in real life has no correlation to bond, people who do his job are of a non descript generic nature, there are some who work out, but undercover field agents need to blend in and be forgettable, it's not much bonds physique that's would be an issue but his, Aston Martin, omega watch etc unless of course he was investigating bankers. The closest dc has come to this is in his first 2. Ford Mondeo in cr, arriving by taxi in qos and when dressed dc looks fit but he's not huge by any means.
What you find in real life has no correlation to bond, people who do his job are of a non descript generic nature, there are some who work out, but undercover field agents need to blend in and be forgettable, it's not much bonds physique that's would be an issue but his, Aston Martin, omega watch etc unless of course he was investigating bankers. The closest dc has come to this is in his first 2. Ford Mondeo in cr, arriving by taxi in qos and when dressed dc looks fit but he's not huge by any means.
Good points. We have to remember that James Bond and his world are a fantasy. Craig's Bond may be a bit more grounded in reality but it's still just as much a fantasy as the Moore's Bond was. Fleming was a real Intelligence Officer during the war but Bond was his Walter Mittiesque alter ego.
So, to pull this thread semi-back on topic...I just watched the trailer for Hiddleston's new film about King Kong. It looks fairly ridiculous, but I'm interested to see how he does as the lead in an action film.
LoeffelholzThe United States, With LovePosts: 8,991Quartermasters
So, to pull this thread semi-back on topic...I just watched the trailer for Hiddleston's new film about King Kong. It looks fairly ridiculous, but I'm interested to see how he does as the lead in an action film.
Looks like great fun, as well! Tom looks good in the trailer.
Check out my Amazon author page!Mark Loeffelholz
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
Someone with the physiques of Moore or Brosnan today, would not be able to make it as a special forces operative.
That's not true at all. SF look like normal people, at least in the UK. For the most part you'd never in a million years mark them as SAS, SBS or SRR etc. In the US the physique of SF is very different though.
As HowardB also notes, the military culture in the US is definitely all about getting big. PEDs? Yep. You bet. It has gotten totally whacked IMO.
Maybe to tie this thread back into the main thread. What matters most to me is that the ACTOR who plays Bond looks convincing in action scenes. He doesn't have to be physically imposing if he moves with athleticism. For instance, I have often thought that Keanu Reeves has been underestimated as an action movie star. To doubters I always say: look how well he moves in John Wick (and you can tell when it's him and not a stunt double). I practice krav maga not judo, but Reeves's moves seem convincing. I believe in his character as a bad-ass assassin.
That's all I want for Bond: an actor who seems to know how to throw a real punch, as opposed to a film punch, and can sprint like someone who's been taught that good form allows you to run faster.
(One last note. As much as I love CR, I don't think Craig is all that convincing in the hand-to-hand scenes. He does better in the other movies, by and large. And the fight scene in SPECTRE ranks among the best in the series in my estimation. You believe that Bond can hurt Hinx and hold him for a while, but that he can't win through brute force alone.)
So, to pull this thread semi-back on topic...I just watched the trailer for Hiddleston's new film about King Kong. It looks fairly ridiculous, but I'm interested to see how he does as the lead in an action film.
Looks like great fun, as well! Tom looks good in the trailer.
Tom does look great, it looks like an audition for Bond.
I just watched the King Kong trailer. I can't tell anything from it about how Hiddleston would be as Bond, but it looks like it's going to be an awful movie. I hope it doesn't hurt Hiddleston's career when it tanks.
Hiddleston does look to be quite the action hero in the Kong trailer. From what I have read, Hiddleston is the nominal lead in the film. Whether or not it bombs is hard to say. You never know with these type of genre films these days. One man's awful can be another man's wonderful. Apparently it takes place during the Vietnam War era and will tie in with the new American Godzilla universe culminating eventually with a King Kong Vs Godzilla film.
Just watched the trailer, popcorn movie through and through, is hiddleston the lead? Samuel l Jackson is more dominant in the trailer, Ill give it a watch see how the new James bond elect gets on, certainly prefer th now he hasn't got a Taylor Swift hanging off him
Comments
Fleming's Bond also was a character from the 50's, that was a sexist and misogynist.
In todays day and age of movies I don't think that would pass.
Bond: “I must be dreaming.”
So you don't think Bond looking like a man who keeps himself in great shape but doesn't look like the Hulk would not pass today either?
Who is/are the screenwriter(s)?
Not one actor that's ever played Bond has looked like the Hulk. Not even Craig in CR. While he was big in that movie, he was not even close to being considered Hulk like.
If you've seen the physiques of todays elite military personnel, you'd know that Craig in CR was far closer to reality and it would be this sort of military background that he would have been chosen from.
Someone with the physiques of Moore or Brosnan today, would not be able to make it as a special forces operative.
Bond: “I must be dreaming.”
I don't know if any have been employed yet - the script outline was done, it appears, 'in house'.
We're certainly not talking man boobs... not even Craig in CR had them!
Agreed 100%
Personally, if someone's job is to eliminate a target they would not be a professional if they expected a bullet to be the only way of doing it. If they did they would not be at the job very long.
Realistically (IMO) if someone is supposed to eliminate a target they better be prepared physically to handle it with their bare hands and Craig was believable in that respect.
Moore or Brosnan I wouldn't even feel worried about.
That's not true at all. SF look like normal people, at least in the UK. For the most part you'd never in a million years mark them as SAS, SBS or SRR etc. In the US the physique of SF is very different though.
Depending on your regiment of course
Except Craig's Bond is not a martial arts master. He uses his fighting skills and brute force to win his fights.
Bond: “I must be dreaming.”
Only in his "blunt instrument" incarnation... other Bonds also use any tools they can find (including Bond's own urine!), some martial arts training and their wit too.
Good points. We have to remember that James Bond and his world are a fantasy. Craig's Bond may be a bit more grounded in reality but it's still just as much a fantasy as the Moore's Bond was. Fleming was a real Intelligence Officer during the war but Bond was his Walter Mittiesque alter ego.
Looks like great fun, as well!
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
As HowardB also notes, the military culture in the US is definitely all about getting big. PEDs? Yep. You bet. It has gotten totally whacked IMO.
Maybe to tie this thread back into the main thread. What matters most to me is that the ACTOR who plays Bond looks convincing in action scenes. He doesn't have to be physically imposing if he moves with athleticism. For instance, I have often thought that Keanu Reeves has been underestimated as an action movie star. To doubters I always say: look how well he moves in John Wick (and you can tell when it's him and not a stunt double). I practice krav maga not judo, but Reeves's moves seem convincing. I believe in his character as a bad-ass assassin.
That's all I want for Bond: an actor who seems to know how to throw a real punch, as opposed to a film punch, and can sprint like someone who's been taught that good form allows you to run faster.
(One last note. As much as I love CR, I don't think Craig is all that convincing in the hand-to-hand scenes. He does better in the other movies, by and large. And the fight scene in SPECTRE ranks among the best in the series in my estimation. You believe that Bond can hurt Hinx and hold him for a while, but that he can't win through brute force alone.)
Tom does look great, it looks like an audition for Bond.